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Are straight people born straight?

  • psubills62 said...

    Haha it depends on how you're determining "right" and "wrong."

    The root of the problem is if the practice you're outlawing is itself considered "wrong." If someone considers something (whatever it may be) to be wrong, even if it's not "directly" affecting their life, I'd expect them to not want to live in a society where it is either accepted or applauded.

    I think drinking domestic lite beers is wrong.

    In this country, you are free to do anything you want until it affects the rights of others. There are a few things (namely illegal drugs) that fall outside that general rule.

    Two dudes (or chicks) hooking up doesn't affect my rights in the least, so I don't care.

    Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.

    SpartanRocky

  • SpartanRocky said...

    I think drinking domestic lite beers is wrong.

    In this country, you are free to do anything you want until it affects the rights of others. There are a few things (namely illegal drugs) that fall outside that general rule.

    Two dudes (or chicks) hooking up doesn't affect my rights in the least, so I don't care.

    Exactly!!!

    Lots of chit I don't like, doesn't mean it's wrong. I hate seafood, doesn't mean it's wrong to eat it.

    Just live your life, let gays live their lives. No one is expecting you to be friends with gay people, or be at their weddings.

    Just don't let it bother you.

    It's the 21st century for christ sake, I don't see how ridiculing homosexuals is any better than racism.

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    mriderblue16

  • mriderblue16 said...

    Ridiculing someone for their beliefs, or actions if they affect no one is wrong.

    A guy who likes guys isn't negatively affecting your life whatsoever. So condemning their actions is pretty messed up.

    Is that really the only requirement we have now? "If it doesn't affect you, it's fine." Killings in Nigeria don't affect my life directly either, but believe it or not, I'd like to stop those too.

    How is condemning their actions messed up if I believe they're wrong? Guess what, the Sandusky incidents haven't affected my life directly either...is it messed up to condemn him?

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    psubills62

  • LOSNOLES said...

    Yes we were all born straight. If homosexuality was meant to be dont you think they would be able to reproduce?

    That has nothing to do with the argument. Being able to reproduce doesn't mean you're right.

    For God's sake, dozens of animals can be homosexual, does that mean they're wrong and we should kill them?

    TalHawkins112

  • psubills62 said...

    Is that really the only requirement we have now? "If it doesn't affect you, it's fine." Killings in Nigeria don't affect my life directly either, but believe it or not, I'd like to stop those too.

    How is condemning their actions messed up if I believe they're wrong? Guess what, the Sandusky incidents haven't affected my life directly either...is it messed up to condemn him?

    They affect peoples lives negatively.

    Gay people being together doesn't affect your life negatively at all.

    It's like a dude macking an ugly fat chick, I don't agree but I'm not going to preach to him how it's messed up.

    Keep your beliefs to yourself as long as it's not hurting anybody.

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    mriderblue16

  • psubills62 said...

    Is that really the only requirement we have now? "If it doesn't affect you, it's fine." Killings in Nigeria don't affect my life directly either, but believe it or not, I'd like to stop those too.

    How is condemning their actions messed up if I believe they're wrong? Guess what, the Sandusky incidents haven't affected my life directly either...is it messed up to condemn him?

    No, it's that being gay affects no one else's rights. Killing is wrong because it affects an individual's rights, namely the right to exist.

    Think about it. It's ok to drink as much as you want, until it starts infringing on the rights of others. That's why you have public intox laws, drunken disorderlies, drunk driving laws, etc. Once you start interfering with other people, you're cut off.

    You can play music as loud as you want . . . provided you don't disturb someone else.

    Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.

    SpartanRocky

  • psubills62 said...

    Is that really the only requirement we have now? "If it doesn't affect you, it's fine." Killings in Nigeria don't affect my life directly either, but believe it or not, I'd like to stop those too.

    How is condemning their actions messed up if I believe they're wrong? Guess what, the Sandusky incidents haven't affected my life directly either...is it messed up to condemn him?

    Ah, but killing someone and raping children directly affected those people killed and the children raped therefore they interfered with other people's rights.

    Two gay people being married and having the same rights as everyone else doesn't interfere with anyone else's rights.

    TalHawkins112

  • psubills62 said...

    Is that really the only requirement we have now? "If it doesn't affect you, it's fine." Killings in Nigeria don't affect my life directly either, but believe it or not, I'd like to stop those too.

    How is condemning their actions messed up if I believe they're wrong? Guess what, the Sandusky incidents haven't affected my life directly either...is it messed up to condemn him?

    Good grief. First, killings in Nigeria cannot be prosecuted under US law. Second, Sandusky affected many children. Whether you were personally affected or not is completely irrelevant.

    This post was edited by Grand Slam on 3/22/2012 at 11:17 AM

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    !!!

    Grand Slam

  • mriderblue16 said...

    They affect peoples lives negatively.

    Gay people being together doesn't affect your life negatively at all.

    It's like a dude macking an ugly fat chick, I don't agree but I'm not going to preach to him how it's messed up.

    Keep your beliefs to yourself as long as it's not hurting anybody.

    But they're not affecting my life negatively.

    Oh, so now if it's affecting just SOMEONE's life negatively, then it's not cool. That's opening up a whole 'nother can of worms.

    And why am I supposed to keep my beliefs to myself? Why is it wrong to argue against something I believe is wrong?

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    psubills62

  • Grand Slam said...

    Good grief. First, killings under Nigeria cannot be prosecuted under US law. Second, Sandusky affected many children. Whether you were personally affected or not is completely irrelevant.

    Completely irrelevant? That seems to be the main gist of people's arguments here. "You're not affected, so just shut up."

    Should I really go back through this thread and quote exactly where people told me essentially that?

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    psubills62

  • psubills62 said...

    But they're not affecting my life negatively.

    Oh, so now if it's affecting just SOMEONE's life negatively, then it's not cool. That's opening up a whole 'nother can of worms.

    And why am I supposed to keep my beliefs to myself? Why is it wrong to argue against something I believe is wrong?

    I don't care if you try to convince them they're wrong but trying to put laws in place preventing their free will and right to pursue happiness is wrong.

    TalHawkins112

  • SpartanRocky said...

    No, it's that being gay affects no one else's rights. Killing is wrong because it affects an individual's rights, namely the right to exist.

    Think about it. It's ok to drink as much as you want, until it starts infringing on the rights of others. That's why you have public intox laws, drunken disorderlies, drunk driving laws, etc. Once you start interfering with other people, you're cut off.

    You can play music as loud as you want . . . provided you don't disturb someone else.

    Aren't there laws affecting a minor's right to drink? If they don't drive and cause an accident, that really doesn't affect anyone else's rights.

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    psubills62

  • TalHawkins112 said...

    I don't care if you try to convince them they're wrong but trying to put laws in place preventing their free will and right to pursue happiness is wrong.

    No, no , no. Anything they don't agree with should be illegal.

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    !!!

    Grand Slam

  • TalHawkins112 said...

    I don't care if you try to convince them they're wrong but trying to put laws in place preventing their free will and right to pursue happiness is wrong.

    And we come back to that argument - wrong according to what?

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    psubills62

  • psubills62 said...

    But they're not affecting my life negatively.

    Oh, so now if it's affecting just SOMEONE's life negatively, then it's not cool. That's opening up a whole 'nother can of worms.

    And why am I supposed to keep my beliefs to myself? Why is it wrong to argue against something I believe is wrong?

    It always was someone's life, not just you personally.

    Keep your beliefs to yourself because they are archaic, and hurtful. Just like racism.

    You clearly have no exposure to any homosexuals in your life.

    I hope you have a child who is gay, it will really show you how silly your views are. Would you berate your own child for being wrong if he/she is gay?

    If so you are just a terrible human being.

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    mriderblue16

  • psubills62 said...

    But they're not affecting my life negatively.

    Oh, so now if it's affecting just SOMEONE's life negatively, then it's not cool. That's opening up a whole 'nother can of worms.

    And why am I supposed to keep my beliefs to myself? Why is it wrong to argue against something I believe is wrong?

    You're confusing the argument. We used the term "me" as in "it doesn't affect my rights personally" as an example because it affects no one's rights.

    You can share your beliefs, but you cannot act on them in a way that interefers with the rights of someone else.

    For instance, if I see you drinking a Coors light, I cannot grab the bottle out of your hand and throw it away. Legally, that's conversion / perhaps larceny by force. It's my belief that no one should be drinking that watered down crap, but I cannot force that belief on others.

    Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.

    SpartanRocky

  • psubills62 said...

    Aren't there laws affecting a minor's right to drink? If they don't drive and cause an accident, that really doesn't affect anyone else's rights.

    Yeh they are. They are endangering peoples lives, increasing the risk of a crash.

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    mriderblue16

  • LOSNOLES said...

    Yes we were all born straight. If homosexuality was meant to be dont you think they would be able to reproduce?

    Man you just reinforced every thought I had of how ignorant some people can be.

    It's my island. I OWN IT.

    beirutvol

  • mriderblue16 said...

    Yeh they are. They are endangering peoples lives, increasing the risk of a crash.

    But that requires that the minor also drives. If they aren't driving, it's not a problem.

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    psubills62

  • SpartanRocky said...

    You're confusing the argument. We used the term "me" as in "it doesn't affect my rights personally" as an example because it affects no one's rights.

    You can share your beliefs, but you cannot act on them in a way that interefers with the rights of someone else.

    For instance, if I see you drinking a Coors light, I cannot grab the bottle out of your hand and throw it away. Legally, that's conversion / perhaps larceny by force. It's my belief that no one should be drinking that watered down crap, but I cannot force that belief on others.

    To the bold - why not? Especially if it can be shown that the behavior is destructive and harmful?

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    psubills62

  • psubills62 said...

    But that requires that the minor also drives. If they aren't driving, it's not a problem.

    We're not talking about minors. We're talking about consenting adults.

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    !!!

    Grand Slam

  • mriderblue16 said...

    It always was someone's life, not just you personally.

    Keep your beliefs to yourself because they are archaic, and hurtful. Just like racism.

    You clearly have no exposure to any homosexuals in your life.

    I hope you have a child who is gay, it will really show you how silly your views are. Would you berate your own child for being wrong if he/she is gay?

    If so you are just a terrible human being.

    lol at comparing this to racism. I'll go ahead and ease up on the lunchtime lashing I was giving the local homosexuals. They've worked in the cornfields hard enough for the morning.

    I'm not going to have a gay child, because gays aren't "born that way." Or are you ignorant enough to believe that piece of crap as well?

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    psubills62

  • psubills62 said...

    To the bold - why not? Especially if it can be shown that the behavior is destructive and harmful?

    How is being a homosexual destructive to anyone? How is being harmful to anyone?

    People who "choose" (more like born) to be gay are affecting no one else's life but their own.

    And just because you don't agree doesn't give you the right to tell them they are wrong, or morally bankrupt or anything.

    I don't agree with black people (obviously just using extreme example not my viewpoint whatsoever) it doesn't give me the right to spit hatred their way. Neither does gayness.

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    mriderblue16

  • Grand Slam said...

    We're not talking about minors. We're talking about consenting adults.

    Why is adulthood a requirement? I thought this was just about protecting people's rights as long as it didn't hurt anyone else. Didn't realize adulthood was a necessity here.

    If a child consents to have sex with an adult, aren't there laws that prevent that "right"?

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    psubills62

  • psubills62 said...

    lol at comparing this to racism. I'll go ahead and ease up on the lunchtime lashing I was giving the local homosexuals. They've worked in the cornfields hard enough for the morning.

    I'm not going to have a gay child, because gays aren't "born that way." Or are you ignorant enough to believe that piece of crap as well?

    What? Gays are that way.

    They don't choose to be gay, they just are.

    And you could well have a gay child, you don't choose as a parent whether they are gay or not.

    I don't see how it's different (racism, hate towards gays) it's all spewing hatred to something you don't like or agree with.

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    mriderblue16

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