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Bama Needs a JUCO CB in This Class

  • Theta said...

    I'm not so sure about that.

    Safety play will be better at times, but you don't add 3 new starters in a Saban secondary and not see a drop off. Plus, who replaces CJ Mosley? Who replaces Jesse Williams?

    '14 and '15 defenses will be elite, but I don't see the '13 defense being elite.

    That's fair, but I believed it going into this season and I continue to believe it. Here is my reasoning:

    Ivory and Lake will prove to be a better 1-2 punch at NT, for our system, than Williams. Williams is a good player, but his game is more suited for end. Ivory has flashed at times this year, and another year in the strength and conditioning program will prove him to be as productive as Chapman IMO. Lake getting on the field already this year is a good sign to me that we can expect him to flash at times next year and prove to be a solid backup at NT.

    We lose Square but Pagan is going to be the best DL we have had since Dareus in terms of ability IMO. With him moving into the starting lineup and Pettway continuing to grow, we will be better up front next year than this year.

    I will make this grouping assuming we lose CJ (which, IMO, is not a lock to happen). We return both outside backers, with Hubbard and Dickson who will both improve. DePreist will be much better next year, and should be able to replace Nico adequately who is situational anyways and comes off the field in passing situations. If we have CJ, then obviously he is here, but I also think Devall is going to make a lot of plays for us in the future and I see that starting next season if CJ leaves. If CJ does in fact leave, I also think you see Tyler Hayes or Dillon Lee take his role as pass coverage specialist. We will be worse in pass coverage, assuming CJ leaves, but the progression of Dickson, Hubbard, and Depriest should make this an improved core in base than we currently have.

    In the secondary, no doubt losing Milliner is a blow. Lester is a quality player, but he is much more suited as a roamer than how he is used this year. The way he has played this year makes him much easier to replace IMO. Belue returns, and I think you will see Geno beat out Fulton for the 2nd spot, with the loser taking the role of 3rd CB. Clinton Dix is back and again as is the theme of this post, should improve. I believe Collins will have a good offseason and take over Lester's role. Likely to see some regression early in the year at this spot just in terms of not having the experience, but I believe later in the year the upgrade as an athlete with his freakish ability will show. Not to be overlooked is the fact that Jarrick will be returning to help us out in Nickel/Dime. He would have started over Perry and Vinnie this year and will get us more athletic on the back end. I think we will be as good as this year in the secondary, not ready to say for sure we will be better after losing a 3 year starter in Lester and a 1st round DB in Milliner.

    Just some thoughts. The biggest progression in terms of improvements is from a guys 1st year starting/getting quality minutes to his 2nd year. Looking at our defense next year, we will have 7 guys (Stinson, Ivory, Dickson, Hubbard, DePreist, Belue, Clinton-Dix) fitting that bill, which doesn't even include Vinnie (who is getting a ton of time this year) and Fulton (who looks like he may get a lot more time the rest of the season).

    Fogtown

  • Fogtown said...

    That's fair, but I believed it going into this season and I continue to believe it. Here is my reasoning:

    Ivory and Lake will prove to be a better 1-2 punch at NT, for our system, than Williams. Williams is a good player, but his game is more suited for end. Ivory has flashed at times this year, and another year in the strength and conditioning program will prove him to be as productive as Chapman IMO. Lake getting on the field already this year is a good sign to me that we can expect him to flash at times next year and prove to be a solid backup at NT.

    We lose Square but Pagan is going to be the best DL we have had since Dareus in terms of ability IMO. With him moving into the starting lineup and Pettway continuing to grow, we will be better up front next year than this year.

    I will make this grouping assuming we lose CJ (which, IMO, is not a lock to happen). We return both outside backers, with Hubbard and Dickson who will both improve. DePreist will be much better next year, and should be able to replace Nico adequately who is situational anyways and comes off the field in passing situations. If we have CJ, then obviously he is here, but I also think Devall is going to make a lot of plays for us in the future and I see that starting next season if CJ leaves. If CJ does in fact leave, I also think you see Tyler Hayes or Dillon Lee take his role as pass coverage specialist. We will be worse in pass coverage, assuming CJ leaves, but the progression of Dickson, Hubbard, and Depriest should make this an improved core in base than we currently have.

    In the secondary, no doubt losing Milliner is a blow. Lester is a quality player, but he is much more suited as a roamer than how he is used this year. The way he has played this year makes him much easier to replace IMO. Belue returns, and I think you will see Geno beat out Fulton for the 2nd spot, with the loser taking the role of 3rd CB. Clinton Dix is back and again as is the theme of this post, should improve. I believe Collins will have a good offseason and take over Lester's role. Likely to see some regression early in the year at this spot just in terms of not having the experience, but I believe later in the year the upgrade as an athlete with his freakish ability will show. Not to be overlooked is the fact that Jarrick will be returning to help us out in Nickel/Dime. He would have started over Perry and Vinnie this year and will get us more athletic on the back end. I think we will be as good as this year in the secondary, not ready to say for sure we will be better after losing a 3 year starter in Lester and a 1st round DB in Milliner.

    Just some thoughts. The biggest progression in terms of improvements is from a guys 1st year starting/getting quality minutes to his 2nd year. Looking at our defense next year, we will have 7 guys (Stinson, Ivory, Dickson, Hubbard, DePreist, Belue, Clinton-Dix) fitting that bill, which doesn't even include Vinnie (who is getting a ton of time this year) and Fulton (who looks like he may get a lot more time the rest of the season).

    Great post Fog. But I fear you may be relying on first year starters a little too much. If Ivory and Lake play well and we can find a pass rusher that can cause havoc then I agree. If not, hopefully a one loss team makes it in.

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    Weedline ●

  • I'm not sure Mosley is going to te NFL after this year. We don't play him on obvious running situations. I highly doubt he's more than a 3rd-4th down pick at this point being that he's a situational backer. He needs to add another 15lbs before he seriously thinks about going to the NfL.

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    DrStache

  • I may be higher on Ivory than most. But when he has played this year, he has been very good about getting a push for the most part. I tend to be more comfortable relying on guys like Ivory to play and play well versus a guy like Geno or Collins. Ivory has gotten a lot of reps this year and it shouldn't be a BIG jump to him starting in terms of what he will see and expect. Guys like Geno or Collins will be a lot more risky as first year starters, which is why I could see us being a little worse early next year in the secondary.

    Fogtown

  • You guys just leave white alone

    Kthxbye

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    swizz ●

  • Weedline said...

    Since I'm banned on BOL, I'll post this here. We need a JUCO CB in this class. After this season our CB roster looks like this:

    Deion Belue SR
    John Fulton rSR
    Geno Smith SO
    Bradley Sylve rSO
    Jabril Washington rSO

    Maurice Smith FR
    Anthony Averett FR (Probably will end up at safety)
    Jonathan Ford/Marques White FR

    So that's who we have returning. Belue and Fulton should start based on seniority. Belue has played well sporadically, but not up to what we are used to. He will have to do for the moment, but what is of a concern is the other two spots. Fulton has been getting abused. He made a few plays last night but looked lost most the time. It's not a 'give him another year to learn the system' type thing anymore. It's a 'oh crap, he can't play this position at a high level' type of thing. He will get picked on all year if he is on the field 95% of the time.

    Geno Smith is young and talented but I'm not sure he's ready to start. He might not have a choice though, and I think he starts over Fulton if those are the only two options. The others are not ready and might never be.

    We like to blitz and put our CB's on an island. Well, next year that might cause problems. Losing our JUCO CB from last year hurt and I think he needs to be replaced in this class. He can give us another option going into the Spring and provide depth if we have a guy go down. Remember, we will have to play Texas A&M again next year ad will need all the CB's we can get.


    Cant believe you are banned on BOL.

    Were you able to get CNS to call Jeremy Johnson yet? If not maybe you could throw this advice to him when you do.

    mrgolf1

  • Weedline said...

    Thanks. Bama fans hate anything said not 100% in their favor.

    I was looking over the JUCO CB's in the rankings and there are some slim picking in there. Man. Maybe Saban can pull a gem or steal Mark Richts CB.

    Not this Bama fan. We do need corner help. I also think we need more speed at DE.

    BamaNtn92

  • BamaNtn92 said...

    Not this Bama fan. We do need corner help. I also think we need more speed at DE.

    We do. Hubbard has not been as productive as we thought he was going to be. He's still young, but he needs to show up next year. Hopefully Devall (saying he stays at JACK and does not move inside) and Jonathan Allen will be there to push him.

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    Weedline ●

  • Weedline said...

    Great post Fog. But I fear you may be relying on first year starters a little too much. If Ivory and Lake play well and we can find a pass rusher that can cause havoc then I agree. If not, hopefully a one loss team makes it in.

    I really want to see Ryan Anderson. I know he's raw but I'm hoping he can improve our pass rushing next year with Devall

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    Ichabod

  • Ichabod said...

    I really want to see Ryan Anderson. I know he's raw but I'm hoping he can improve our pass rushing next year with Devall

    Anderson is an interesting situation. I have only read two reports on him so far and each one contradicts the other. One says he's not quick enough to play JACK and too small to play DE. The other says he is far advanced in his skill set at DE and will be a beast. I have no idea either way and he will definitely be one to watch for at A Day. Good call

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    Weedline ●

  • Weedline said...

    Anderson is an interesting situation. I have only read two reports on him so far and each one contradicts the other. One says he's not quick enough to play JACK and too small to play DE. The other says he is far advanced in his skill set at DE and will be a beast. I have no idea either way and he will definitely be one to watch for at A Day. Good call

    But like you NG I have been worried about. Williams is a better end than NG.

    I just want a big ole fatty and stick him right in the middle a la Terrence Cody.

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    Ichabod

  • Wouldnt surprise me to see Cyrus Jones at CB next year. We're pretty deep at WR. I hope we swing Ramsey from Southern Cal.

    BamaNtn92

  • BamaNtn92 said...

    Wouldnt surprise me to see Cyrus Jones at CB next year. We're pretty deep at WR. I hope we swing Ramsey from Southern Cal.

    Cyrus is a guy I think would be successful on either side of the ball. In fact, I thought he would play defense when he got on campus. But he couldn't fill the void this year right away because he would have to learn the position. Maybe Saban would move him there to try and provide future depth I don't know.

    It's a lot easier creating a championship team than maintaining one IMO. Lots and lots of holes to fill

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    Weedline ●

  • Fulton is now in a boot with a bad turf toe injury. It can be very hard to ever come back from turf toe. It just depends on how his body responds. We need a JUCO CB even more now than before.

    This post was edited by Weedline on 11/14/2012 at 8:36 PM

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    Weedline ●

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