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Big Ten fans. Over-signing

  • Status said...

    Wow are these people serious? They have literally destroyed their own argument.

    Funny how naive they are and I guarantee the overwhelming majority weren't even doing their own research.

    These guys probably read the National Inquirer and believe everything inside it.

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    Macdaddy7930

  • AngryChair91 said...

    Really? Explain how Saban pushed out 21kids in 2 years? That's a whole recruiting class. Sounds fishy too me. No one else does this outside the SEC.

    Glen Harbin - played baseball
    Demtrius Goode - graduated from school with a degree
    Petey Smith - kicked off team
    Brandon Moore - now starts at Texas
    Corey Grant - now at Auburn
    Keiwone Malone - transferred to Memphis for playing time
    Robby Green - kicked off team for failing NCAA drug test
    Darrington Sentimore - started at TN, just left early for NFL Draft
    Aaron Douglas - passed away
    Kerry Murphy - graduated from school with a degree
    Kendal Kelly - medical hardship
    Wes Neighbors - graduated from school with a degree

    Terry Grant - graduated from school wtih a degree
    Travis Sikes - was arrested for DUI
    Rod Woodson -
    Star Jackson - transfered to GA State for playing time
    Deion Belue - starter at CB, went to JUCO
    Alfy Hill - denied eligibility by NCAA
    Taylor Pharr - medical hardship
    Milton Talbert - medical hardship
    Darius McKeller - medical hardship
    Wilson Love - on 2012 roster
    Ronnie Carswell - left because of lack of playing time

    It just does this guy a disservice when he clearly adds names in there to help his cause that just don't belong in this discussion. Guys who have been in the program for 4 years and graduated, guys who have passed away, guys who didnt get into school, guys who transferred to other Division 1 schools and are playing now when they would not be playing at Alabama and guys who chose to play MLB baseball are just ridiculous to include in this listing. He would still have an interesting argument/discussion if he only used players who got medical hardships, or even if he included guys who transferred (though that's ridiculous in its own right for a program like Alabama where kids who can't play know they can play at lesser programs and want to get PT).

    Including guys who never got into school, died, picked MLB or were denied entry by the NCAA? How does that have anything to do with Alabama getting rid of kids? That's just ridiculous. Heck, 3 or 4 of those guys on the list PLAYED for Alabama this season and 2 others started on the defensive lines of Texas and Tennessee.

    This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by Brian Henry on 1/15/2013 at 1:17 PM

    Brian Henry

  • Also, in the past 5 years Alabama has had 13 indiviuals leave early for the NFL Draft

    2009
    - Glen Coffee
    - Andre Smith

    2010
    - Kareem Jackson
    - Rolando McClain

    2011
    - Mark Ingram
    - Julio Jones
    - Marcell Dareus

    2012
    - Donta Hightower
    - Dre Kilpatrick
    - Trent Richardson

    2013
    - Dee Milliner
    - Eddie Lacey
    - DJ Fluker

    Brian Henry

  • Status said...

    Wow are these people serious? They have literally destroyed their own argument.

    To be fair, SEC defenders have repeatedly offered up these contradictory defenses:

    --We don't oversign
    --We do but only to make up for legitimate roster openings
    --We do, but it's just because our players are more inclined to seek out more playing time (as opposed to bench-warmers at non-SEC schools)
    --We don't because our coaches are good at doing math and know all of the transfers and injuries beforehand, so even though we technically oversign, it doesn't really count
    --So what if we do? If a kid can't cut it on the field, how is it different than if a kid can't cut it in the classroom?
    --So what if we do? We'd be dominant even if we didn't
    --Yeah, we may have convinced some guys to go elsewhere and lied about why we did so, but we didn't *force* anyone to leave.
    --It's irrelevant whether we do or not because Ohio State does it
    --It's irrelevant whether we do or not because Texas does it
    --It's irrelevant because everyone does it
    --Didn't Lane Kiffin just reject an early enrollee DE?
    --etc.

    I'm not saying any of the above arguments are necessarily incorrect (OK - a few of them are, without a doubt, totally false). However, it's safe to say neither side has argued their point of view in a uniform, sensible manner -- both sides are all over the place.

    This post was edited by MikeCaramba on 1/15/2013 at 1:33 PM

    MikeCaramba

  • MikeCaramba said...

    To be fair, SEC defenders have repeatedly offered up these contradictory defenses:

    --We don't oversign --We do but only to make up for legitimate roster openings --We do, but it's just because our players are more inclined to seek out more playing time (as opposed to bench-warmers at non-SEC schools) --We don't because our coaches are good at doing math and know all of the transfers and injuries beforehand, so even though we technically oversign, it doesn't really count --So what if we do? If a kid can't cut it on the field, how is it different than if a kid can't cut it in the classroom? --So what if we do? We'd be dominant even if we didn't --Yeah, we may have convinced some guys to go elsewhere and lied about why we did so, but we didn't *force* anyone to leave. --It's irrelevant whether we do or not because Ohio State does it --It's irrelevant whether we do or not because Texas does it --It's irrelevant because everyone does it --Didn't Lane Kiffin just reject an early enrollee DE? --etc.

    I'm not saying any of the above arguments are necessarily incorrect (OK - a few of them are, without a doubt, totally false). However, it's safe to say neither side has argued their point of view in a uniform, sensible manner -- both sides are all over the place.

    Agree, I think they are serious discussions that can be had about it. I just think some (on both sides, though since one side is the one accusing the other of being dirty and unethical it all kind of comes back to them) give vagaries like I posted above to try and make their argument sound better and bigger than it really is.

    Brian Henry

  • Brian Henry said...

    Agree, I think they are serious discussions that can be had about it. I just think some (on both sides, though since one side is the one accusing the other of being dirty and unethical it all kind of comes back to them) give vagaries like I posted above to try and make their argument sound better and bigger than it really is.

    Yeah. I'm anti-oversigning (as are a lot of SEC fans, I believe), but I'm not really interested in the who-did-what debate at all. I think oversigning wrong, regardless of who does it, and would like to see rules implemented that effectively prevent it from happening.

    MikeCaramba