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Can we at least acknowledge that oversigning is unethical?

  • Devidee is jacking off knowing that an over-signing thread has made it four pages.

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    Clemson

  • CrimsonJunkie said...

    Not all of them, no. I do know that they aren't just banished from the team like you make it out to be.

    How can one abuse something that is signed off on by the player, a doctor, and the NCAA? We are using it in compliance with NCAA regulation, so it sounds like the AD's need to take it up with them. Afterall, they're the ones approving them.

    Does the NCAA conduct an exit interview with these players? I don't think so. Is the doctor indpendent or an employee of the school?

    Saban is on record saying he "medicals" players. Is Saban making the call? Is a team doctor really going to go against what the head coach wants?

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    devidee ●

  • devidee said...

    You realize that it is the SEC ADs bringing this legislation up. If they didn't think there was abuse of medical hardships why would they even address it?

    They lurk on 247 and are tired of the front page being clogged with your threads?

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    mpcoan

  • devidee said...

    Does the NCAA conduct an exit interview with these players? I don't think so. Is the doctor indpendent or an employee of the school?

    Saban is on record saying he "medicals" players. Is Saban making the call? Is a team doctor really going to go against what the head coach wants?

    God, you are an idiot. You seriously believe a doctor would risk his job to lie about some non starting college football player's injury? Seriously? gtfo

    signature image

    10 Major Poll National Titles (CFB record) 35 Bowl Wins (CFB record) 61 Wins over last 5 years (CFB record)

    coolstorybro

  • coolstorybro said...

    God, you are an idiot. You seriously believe a doctor would risk his job to lie about some non starting college football player's injury? Seriously? gtfo

    He's not really risking his Job if more than just he is in on it.

    (note: Not saying that there is some conspiracy going on places, just saying you can't dismiss the claim simply because the Doctor would be putting his job on the line. It's not like team doctors haven't done questionable things before)

    theyellow_dup

  • coolstorybro said...

    God, you are an idiot. You seriously believe a doctor would risk his job to lie about some non starting college football player's injury? Seriously? gtfo

    Right. Team doctors are completely beyond reproach.

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    devidee ●

  • devidee said...

    Right. Team doctors are completely beyond reproach.

    Dude, team doctors do not solely work with 1 school. They don't solely work with just teams. They work for a lot of different people and would definitely not want to lie about some scrub college player. You sound crazy.

    Your basic line of reasoning is that in order for Alabama to have 10 medical scholarships, over the last 10 years, given out to players the doctors obviously lied about them. Really? It couldn't be that the kid is actually injured?

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    10 Major Poll National Titles (CFB record) 35 Bowl Wins (CFB record) 61 Wins over last 5 years (CFB record)

    coolstorybro

  • coolstorybro said...

    Dude, team doctors do not solely work with 1 school. They don't solely work with just teams. They work for a lot of different people and would definitely not want to lie about some scrub college player. You sound crazy.

    Your basic line of reasoning is that in order for Alabama to have 10 medical scholarships, over the last 10 years, given out to players the doctors obviously lied about them. Really? It couldn't be that the kid is actually injured?

    10 over the last 10 years? Try 12 in the past three years. Way, way more than any other team in your conference.

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    devidee ●

  • devidee said...

    10 over the last 10 years? Try 12 in the past three years. Way, way more than any other team in your conference.

    So what? They are signed off by the NCAA, the DOCTORS, and the STUDENT himself. For your assertion to make any sense, you rely on the supposed fact that all three of these are lying which is highly doubtful and borderline retarded.

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    10 Major Poll National Titles (CFB record) 35 Bowl Wins (CFB record) 61 Wins over last 5 years (CFB record)

    coolstorybro

  • coolstorybro said...

    So what? They are signed off by the NCAA, the DOCTORS, and the STUDENT himself. For your assertion to make any sense, you rely on the supposed fact that all three of these are lying which is highly doubtful and borderline retarded.

    What kind of sign off does the NCAA actually do?

    Do you have an explanation for the huge disparity in medical hardships handed out?

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    devidee ●

  • coolstorybro said...

    So what? They are signed off by the NCAA, the DOCTORS, and the STUDENT himself. For your assertion to make any sense, you rely on the supposed fact that all three of these are lying which is highly doubtful and borderline retarded.

    Looking at the facts and raising questions from them is not "borderline retarded." When you're team is dwarfing the rest if it's league in Medical Scholarships, while also being one of the biggest schools to over sign during that period. It's down right logical to walk away with questions and a little skepticism.

    OH! And one more thing. Do you have a link to show what a student must go through to be approved for a medical scholarship? From the research I've done I don't see a single thing about the NCAA and the Player currently having to sign off on it (for sure the NCAA). So curious where you're getting the information that the NCAA is involved in the process.

    This post was edited by theyellow_dup on 5/27/2011 at 12:32 PM

    theyellow_dup

  • theyellowdart said...

    Looking at the facts and raising questions from them is not "borderline retarded." When you're team is dwarfing the rest if it's league in Medical Scholarships, while also being one of the biggest schools to over sign during that period. It's down right logical to walk away with questions and a little skepticism.

    How the censored did you find someone to stack off on that board with A3? Nice to fall ass backwards into money

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    mpcoan

  • devidee said...

    What kind of sign off does the NCAA actually do?

    Do you have an explanation for the huge disparity in medical hardships handed out?

    Here's an idea: Why don't you go case by case for all of Alabama's medical hardships? Identify the injury and determine if it is an injury. What you are doing is blanketing the entire lot of hardships and calling BS on them EVEN THOUGH they have been processed and approved through multiple parties.

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    10 Major Poll National Titles (CFB record) 35 Bowl Wins (CFB record) 61 Wins over last 5 years (CFB record)

    coolstorybro

  • coolstorybro said...

    Here's an idea: Why don't you go case by case for all of Alabama's medical hardships? Identify the injury and determine if it is an injury. What you are doing is blanketing the entire lot of hardships and calling BS on them EVEN THOUGH they have been processed and approved through multiple parties.

    Why don't you explain them for us? You're the Alabama fan, so you should have a much easier time than a non-fan in terms of figuring out who's who.

    FTR, in the past 5 years, MSU has had 4 players with medical hardship

    1. Jason Diehl, OL: Neck and Back, never played a down for MSU, but did graduate.

    2. Arthur Ray Jr, OG: Bone cancer in his leg. Just cleared medical hardship waivers and participated in the spring game. Now counts towards our scholarship count.

    3. David Barrent, OT: Retired from football this year due to lingering back injury from HS

    4. Joe Boisture, QB: Retired from football this year due to lingering back injury from HS (not sure if it's the same condition as Barrent)

    Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.

    SpartanRocky

  • SpartanRocky said...

    Why don't you explain them for us? You're the Alabama fan, so you should have a much easier time than a non-fan in terms of figuring out who's who.

    FTR, in the past 5 years, MSU has had 4 players with medical hardship

    1. Jason Diehl, OL: Neck and Back, never played a down for MSU, but did graduate.

    2. Arthur Ray Jr, OG: Bone cancer in his leg. Just cleared medical hardship waivers and participated in the spring game. Now counts towards our scholarship count.

    3. David Barrent, OT: Retired from football this year due to lingering back injury from HS

    4. Joe Boisture, QB: Retired from football this year due to lingering back injury from HS (not sure if it's the same condition as Barrent)

    Why would I have to find all that info? I'm not on the side of the issue that is trying to debunk them. You find it.

    I can think of the first one under Saban. Tyrone Prothro. Yep, he definitely didn't deserve to be put on medical. Yep.

    This post was edited by coolstorybro on 5/27/2011 at 1:01 PM

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    10 Major Poll National Titles (CFB record) 35 Bowl Wins (CFB record) 61 Wins over last 5 years (CFB record)

    coolstorybro

  • Don't look now, but oversigning.com has 4 B1G schools over their recruiting budget for last signing day- OSU, Michigan, Michigan State, and PSU.

    Maybe the SEC isn't the only league that needs to look at additional oversigning legislation.

    This post was edited by RTR22 on 5/27/2011 at 1:05 PM

    RTR22

  • coolstorybro said...

    Here's an idea: Why don't you go case by case for all of Alabama's medical hardships? Identify the injury and determine if it is an injury. What you are doing is blanketing the entire lot of hardships and calling BS on them EVEN THOUGH they have been processed and approved through multiple parties.

    I'm not calling BS on all of them. What I am saying is that the disparity in medical hardships handed out by Saban as opposed to the rest of the conference is alarming.

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    devidee ●

  • RTR22 said...

    Don't look now, but oversigning.com has 4 B1G schools over their recruiting budget for last signing day- OSU, Michigan, Michigan State, and PSU.

    Maybe the SEC isn't the only league that needs to look at additional oversigning legislation.

    This is how the Big 10 does it and it is much stricter than what the NCAA allows...

    The current Big 10 rules are based on the 85 scholarship limit first, then the 25 annual limit. If a Big 10 school has 16 scholarships available, they can accept up to 19 signed letters of intent, but there's a catch. The school has to petition the Big 10 office for permission to accept those 3 extra signed letters of intent and they have to explain why they are going over.

    But there's more, before they petition to accept the oversigned letter of intent, they have to petition for permission to issue a written offer that is over the 85 limit. That's right, the Big 10 office controls the number of offers the school can issue and just like the number of signed letters of intent a school can accept, Big 10 schools are only allowed to offer 3 more scholarships than they have room for under the 85 limit.

    So despite the NCAA allowing a school to sign and bring in 25 new players each year, if a Big 10 school has room for 16 new recruits the most they will be allowed is 19 by the Big 10 office and the three extra have to be documented.

    This post was edited by devidee on 5/27/2011 at 1:09 PM

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    devidee ●

  • devidee said...

    This is how the Big 10 does it and it is much stricter than what the NCAA allows...

    The current Big 10 rules are based on the 85 scholarship limit first, then the 25 annual limit. If a Big 10 school has 16 scholarships available, they can accept up to 19 signed letters of intent, but there's a catch. The school has to petition the Big 10 office for permission to accept those 3 extra signed letters of intent and they have to explain why they are going over.

    But there's more, before they petition to accept the oversigned letter of intent, they have to petition for permission to issue a written offer that is over the 85 limit. That's right, the Big 10 office controls the number of offers the school can issue and just like the number of signed letters of intent a school can accept, Big 10 schools are only allowed to offer 3 more scholarships than they have room for under the 85 limit.

    So despite the NCAA allowing a school to sign and bring in 25 new players each year, if a Big 10 school has room for 16 new recruits the most they will be allowed is 19 by the Big 10 office and the three extra have to be documents.

    You're still going over budget. What's the difference in forcing kids out before signing day, so you can file the meaningless paperwork and be within the rules, and forcing them out after signing day, as many claim the SEC does?

    You can say that the B1G coaches have a plan in place and everything is mutually agreed upon, but wouldn't that also hold true for SEC coaches?

    OSU had to dump 2 players to accommodate their most recent class. MSU had to dump 4 ! Why should these programs be viewed any different ?

    This post was edited by RTR22 on 5/27/2011 at 1:16 PM

    RTR22

  • devidee said...

    I'm not calling BS on all of them. What I am saying is that the disparity in medical hardships handed out by Saban as opposed to the rest of the conference is alarming.

    No, you are calling BS on them. If you weren't then why would you go off and make f'n charts in excel about it and speak every day about it?

    Why don't we ever discuss the over signing done in other sports? Like basketball. It's waaaaaaay worse in bball than football. only 13 capped scholarships, 2 signing periods, etc.

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    10 Major Poll National Titles (CFB record) 35 Bowl Wins (CFB record) 61 Wins over last 5 years (CFB record)

    coolstorybro

  • RTR22 said...

    You're still going over budget. What's the difference in forcing kids out before signing day, so you can file the meaningless paperwork and be within the rules, and forcing them out after signing day, as many claim the SEC does?

    You can say that the B1G coaches have a plan in place and everything is mutually agreed upon, but wouldn't that also hold true for SEC coaches?

    I can't get over the fact that this dude roots for ohio state and tressel. Tressel, the biggest lying POS in cfb.

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    10 Major Poll National Titles (CFB record) 35 Bowl Wins (CFB record) 61 Wins over last 5 years (CFB record)

    coolstorybro

  • coolstorybro said...

    I can't get over the fact that this dude roots for ohio state and tressel. Tressel, the biggest lying POS in cfb.

    We're assuming that Tressel doesn't lie on his recruiting forms, like he does with NCAA paperwork.

    RTR22

  • RTR22 said...

    You're still going over budget. What's the difference in forcing kids out before signing day, so you can file the meaningless paperwork and be within the rules, and forcing them out after signing day, as many claim the SEC does?

    You can say that the B1G coaches have a plan in place and everything is mutually agreed upon, but wouldn't that also hold true for SEC coaches?

    Those 4 schools are over by an average of 2.

    The 6 SEC schools are over by an average of 8.6.

    That's a huge difference.

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    devidee ●

  • devidee said...

    Those 4 schools are over by an average of 2.

    The 6 SEC schools are over by an average of 8.6.

    That's a huge difference.

    Wait, so you've bitched this whole time and now your argument is "We're cheating, but you're the biggerest cheater...Neh, neh, na boo boo"?

    Wow

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    mpcoan

  • devidee said...

    Those 4 schools are over by an average of 2.

    The 6 SEC schools are over by an average of 8.6.

    That's a huge difference.

    So oversigning is ok, as long as you only do it a little bit?

    And I thought this whole time you guys cared about the athletes!

    RTR22

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