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Doesn't change anything I said or the fact you're wrong. Until Congress declares war on a nation or we get an explicit invite from that country(neither will ever happen) these drone strikes are war crimes, we're just lucky NATO and the UN are scared shitless of pissing us off.
Their not war crimes b/c we are also party of the War on Terror, there are terroist organizations in Pakistan so therefore it is acceptable..
This post was edited by jmsmooth33 16 months ago
We've been conducting drone strikes on Pakistan for the better part of the last decade, killing hundreds of innocent civilains, and people wonder why they're not springing at the chance to help us?
Not that I agree with what those scumbags did, but considering the circumstances it shouldn't be surprising.
I got heated before I apologize btw we are conducting drone strikes b/c we know there are terroists camp or individuals in the country right? lists of terrorism in pakistan: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_in_Pakistan
There are more terrorist organizations in America than Pakistan, so what's the point. War on terror isn't a real thing, Iraq and Afghanistan allow us to be there, Pakistan, Libya, and other countries do not. Big difference, if you had a pest problem at your parents house they would call an exterminator, I couldn't kick in your door and tear your walls out because I'm a concerned citizen and I think you might have bugs.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_in_Pakistan, High valued targets are living in Pakistan and since the highest valued target was found living there, Al-Qaeda is usually not always in co-operation with Pakistan forces. That is completely different than terroist organization in the USA where our government 100% prohibits it..
There has been a war declared on terrorism and no country is singled out, all fairness went out the window when Bin Laden planned and ordered the attacks on the U.S and killed our innocent civilians now the fight has been taken to them and the ones harboring the terrorists. Pretty plain and simple! Cut and dried! If the shoes were on the other foot don't think for a second that our government would not over turn every stone looking for the guilty parties and turn them over, and they damn sure would not be protected. The only time these country's care about their women and children is when somebody else kills them before they get a chance to do so them selves, their very own atrocities are well documented.
Wikipedia probably isn't allowed as a source at your high school so shouldn't be used here, regardless, your own 'source' basically says Pakistan sucked in the 80s, 99.99% of citizens think "terrorism" is a misguided holy war and want nothing to do with it, and that most of their attention is on the ongoing terrorist attacks amongst themselves between opposing Muslim sects.
This thread wasn't supposed to be about Pakistan or the validity of drone strikes. More of the fact that Obama gets up there and acts all sad and the media fawns over him, meanwhile he's approved programs that he knows have resulting in the deaths of innocent children.
They still co-exist with Al-Qaeda which is unacceptable if they 100% banned Al Qaeda they wouldn't be getting struck by drones..
This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by jmsmooth33 16 months ago
You can't declare war on non tangible entities. To say killing a couple hundred brown people every day to save 1 'muricans life is fucked. Plain and simple. Cut and DRY. International laws are being broken and tip-toed around but nobody wants to speak out against us.
This post was edited by SCirish843 16 months ago
It's called a War on terror and if your country supports terroism like Pakistan who housed Osama bin Laden than yes casualties will occur, terroisim is completely different than a regular war where you can declare war on an entire country so therefore you cant escape killing civilian casualites..
Most middle eastern people think western civilization is the devil, doesn't make them terrorists. Al-qaeda supports a lot of families in rural Pakistan areas, they're aren't willingly going to hunt down and find terrorists when it'll take food out of their children's mouths. Even if Pakistan "banned Al-Qaeda" (which would be impossible since they don't have a 'base' and you can't ban what people believe in their hearts nor monitor your citizens 24/7) they would open the borders just like Iraq and Afghanistan and let us look for them...they don't want to be intruded upon and bombing innocent people until the world gives in to American interests isn't going to get anyone on our side anytime soon.
This post was edited by tired 16 months ago
Oh yea? Was there a lot of precedence set on these "wars on terror" before we made it up? This is a witch hunt, not a war.
There has never been a precedent thats the entire point, it's nearly impossible to find these terrorists unless we drone strike wide areas where there so happens to be innocent civilians.
Fine, then I guess if we slowly start killing off other countries and leave only red blooded Americans(no queers obviously) then eventually we'll have nothing to fear...
wow well this took an interesting turn..... The reason I posted this was because i find it ironic that Obama can be up there crying on national telelvision talking about how innocent those children were and this has to stop..... meanwhile we're killing innocent children but its defendable because we're at "war with terror".... what an effing joke
“If you remember me, then I don't care if everyone else forgets.” ― Haruki Murakami
It turned long before I posted! No different than any other political thread on this board. I am no fan of Obama but this does hit a little closer to home than something that happens over seas. This is all kinda relevant IMO because I don't remember seeing all the Muslims in sand land crying for the ones we lost 9/11 either, leaders included so you would do yourself some good by remembering that day and know that is the reason for the drone strikes to begin with. I am with Obama on this and this only, he took office promising an end to all the middle east fighting but as I suspected he became privy to what was really going on over there and understood the real threat and knew a presence would always be needed so the lesson is if you love your women and children do not hide your terrorists amongst them.
We should just go over to Pakistan and ask them to pretty please stop killing our American soldiers?
How did you feel about the shootings in CT. Where you upset?
Do you think you would feel the same type of empathy about this shooting if it was in Bangladesh?
Societies tend to care more about there "own" more than "others". Thats how human nature and civilizations function.
I agree there is hypocristy here but "the 259 strikes for which he is ultimately responsible killed between 297 and 569 civilians, of whom at least 64 were children," is an extremely low number for civilians deaths in a war-zone.
For comparison sakes up to 1,000,000 million civilians died in the Vietnam War. Many of them killed by brutally carpet bombing Hanoi with B-52 bombers.
We aren't just fighting a "war on terror' That is a terrible misnomer. In addition to "terrorists", we are fighting for the stability of the pro-American government in Afghanistan. We are fighting the Taliban, groups like the Haqqani Network, local warlords, and drug-dealers. These groups want to control Afghanistan and they want to remove Karzai from power.
The people in Pakistan that we are bombing have killed or will one day kill American soldiers and when the war started they used the Pakistani "border" as a hiding place, hence the increase in drone use. They are ethnically related to the Afghan-Taliban and they don't consider themselves "Afghans" or "Pakistanis", they are Pashtuns. A border on a map doesn't mean anything to them. The regions they live in aren't even considered states by the Pakistani government. They are "autonomous tribal areas" and for many years the Pakistani Army and Officials stayed out of these areas for their own safety.
The "soldiers" that attack Americans in Afghanistan are trained and armed in Pakistan. It is a indisputable fact that the "Taliban" was created with the funding and consent of the Pakistani "CIA". If the enemy uses the border as a hiding place, and the government of Pakistan is unable or unwilling to stop them, the US government has every right to go after them.
Also many Pakistanis were "pro-taliban/anti-american" until these groups started attacking and Pakistanis civilians. The Pakistani military was content to sit on the sidelines (occasionally firing artillery at US soldiers) until the "Taliban" and/or "Terrorists" starting killing Pakistani civilians in the Swat valley a few years ago.
Isn't it ironic that many Pakistanis were indifferent to the terror and violence commited IN Afghanistan, until these same "terrorists" starting killing Pakistanis?
.... You do realize that all Muslims aren't terrorists right!
Read this and you might learn something, you do realize that drone planes are in place of real americans right; how would you feel if one of your brothers/relatives/friends were in a plane that was shot down?
.... Sad? But using drones vs actual pilots for literally has nothing to do with the conversation.
My point is your comparing war casualites to a massacre there is no comparison..
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