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Golden is better then Jimbo... I feared it was true. He is going to hoist a crystal ball there - fsufsu
Oh lol, I was wondering where that got deleted I must have hit the wrong key in my frustration with someone who has nothing of value to add, thanks for mentioning it for me.
The Smoot Tariff Act and starting a world wide trade war helped to turn a recession into a depression, so when FDR took over instead of having him and the new democratic congress repeal it, we instead of tried to do other policies that didn't work. Instead of letting the monetary deflate and let prices adjust to the new money base, we pursed price controls and other monetary polices to try and inflate the money supply that didnt work. Japan did the same thing in the 90s and went through a decade of no growth.
To be honest the only policy of the New Deal that I liked was the FDIC insurance for banks.
Really come one, what policies did FDR do that were so wonderful. I just know some of you guys can contribute something meaningful to the discussion.
Paying farmers to burn and not grow crops just to keep the price of a product high is insane, and that is what we were doing.
When there is overproduction and the price of a product gets to low, then the inefficient producers will get out of the business and do something else and the lower production will help the economy. Just paying people to not grow crops doesn't reallocate the economy's resources to more effient uses.
Do you support the regulation of securities that took place shortly after the crash? (you can agree with them philosophically, without agreeing with every aspect of their substance or implementation).
hmm, still no FDR positive policeis mentioned by you. Heck, by mentioning the FDIC insurance I have contributed more pro FDR stuff than you have. But carry on your little icons and no mention of actual policies.
Wait, Economics isn't based on me picking and choosing what supports my argument?
Please watch this!
To a degree, I think the mandortary margin requirements that came out of them were good. The rest of the benefits versus costs is debatable, I think the rest of the benefits versus cost is a wash.
Not to your point, but for some info on the unemployment numbers, the thing with the crash that people don't realize is that high unemployment numbers that we saw later in the 1930s didn't start until 1931. The unemployment numbers in 1929 and 1930 indicated a normal recession. Pretty much all the World governments messed up the recovery with stupid law after stupid law.
Oh and link provided for the unemployment numbers.
Awww, how nice you got the unemployment numbers in a nice graph while I was putting them in another response. Thanks, as you can see, our unemployment only got back to respectable levels after ww2 was nearly over. Nice to help show corralation with my point that ww2 helped to get us out of the great depression, but none of the other policies did.
yep, Hoover f*cked it up first, FDR came in and didn't repeal the protectionism and money issues and just expanded on them. Seriously all FDR had to do was repeal Hoover and the Republicans mess and lead by example for the rest of the world governments what to do.
Seriously both political parties were messed up with their fiscal policies back then.
This post was edited by robert1975 17 months ago
Look at where the unemployment numbers were above 10% versus below 10%. I don't know about you, but any unemployment above 10% is no good, regardless if it goes up and down some. Before the Great Depression with the exception of wars our unemployment numbers were never above 10%.
Wage and Price controls do not equal a loose money policy, more than one way to create a tight monetary policy.
yep, never claimed to be an english major. I typo a lot and don't really care about writting perfect english in a message board. But hey, muddle the waters by complaining about that. That always worked in debate class, oops it didn't.
btw, just for the record, accounting major, but I took econ classes just for fun as most of my electives.
Dude, if the New Deal policies were so great why were we in double digit unemployment until ww2 came along? Just cause a program sounds good, doesn't mean you ignore the lousy results and claim the programs saved the day.
We also restricted businesses on what they could sell, projects they could do (to not let private contractors compete with the government run construction projects), how much to pay employees though minimum wage (when everyone just needed jobs regardless of how much they earned and any minimum wage hike has led to more unemployment), number of hours employees could work, We created a very pro enviroment for unions (well to be honest the first time unions could really exist) and if unions were such a great way for private industry to perform why is it that less than 10% of non-government jobs today are unionized.
How in today's understanding of good economic policy were any of these things good for the economy?
This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by robert1975 17 months ago
well you understood the point I was making, why don't you refute it with a counter arguement instead of complaining about the grammer?
If we had just let prices reset lower to reflect the deflated monetary supply, it would have hurt everybody's savings, but we would not have had the massive unemployement numbers we saw in the Great Depression. the high unemployment was caused in large part to most people not being able to afford to buy items in price controlled near pre depression pricing with a deflated money supply. We should have just let the prices drop and adjust to the new lower monetary supply. It would have hurt but it would not have led a decade of nearly 15% to 20% unemployment.
Somehow we took a stock crash similar to what we had in 1987 and turned it into a decade long unemployment disaster for the country.
ok, so here's my assertion, FDR spent a decade through price controls, wage controls, limiting what products could be sold, increasing labor unions (to inflate labor price), running budget deficits to provide a few jobs to keep the voters happy enough to reelect him, added more regualtions onto businesses to make it more expensive to run a business and add jobs to the economoy, all of which never addressed the basic problem of our deflated monetary supply. All of these programs seeked to force the monetary supply higher by forcing employers to pay more for labor and to artifically increase the price of goods that should have been lower due to the deflation. Most of FDR programs tried to masked the real problem of a small monetary supply instead of dealing with it. Artifically higher cost of labor and goods led to massive unemployment which turned what should have been a Big Recession of a few years into a Great Depression that lasted the entire decade.
So what is your assertion of FDR programs that helped the Great Depression end? The only thing positive as a FDR fiscal policy I have seen mentioned on here is the military buildup as being part of the new deal, as if with every major country knowing in the mid 30s that the major world powers were arming themselves we wouldn't have done anyways regardless if we were in a depression or not. Every government knew in 1935 that another World War was coming, it was just a matter of when. And since my first statement that started all of this was that ww2 got us out of the Great Depression, I think using the military buildup as part of a successful New Deal just helps make my orginal statement true.
Am I the only one who enjoys their taxes going directly to people mooching welfare?
Good ol unknown village of leroy, why?
Absolutely tiny. Not even on maps I think lol..only significance of this place is that its by batavia and its "the home of jello " where's your family at?
just checking in to see how badly this thread degenerated
www.yohoodent.com ... errybawdee awn ignorle
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