Online Now 2248

The Blue Board

We aren't just committed to college football; we're early enrolling in it.

Online now 1993
Record: 18710 (2/25/2012)

Boards ▾

The Blue Board

We aren't just committed to college football; we're early enrolling in it.

The Green Board

Where the madness isn't just in March.

Reply

The Official Michigan State and Michigan Thread

  • SpartanTailgate

    Jandy

    MrWoodson said... (original post)

    I didn't bring up Tressel, your people did. And Steve Fisher doesn't need exonerating. He hasn't done anything wrong.

    So, honestly, in your deepest heart of hearts, you truly believe that Steve Fisher was a more honest, ethical, and morally law-abiding coach than Tom Izzo?

    signature image

    laconophilia is everywhere... http://www.msu-umbig10.com/

  • SpartanTailgate

    Jandy

    MrWoodson said... (original post)

    I love how all you Sparty fans have fully accepted the fact that you are our little bro. I mean, we don't even have to bring it up anymore. You simply refer to yourselves that way.

    Three reasons.

    1. For flow of conversation purposes, it seems to give you a comical sense of satisfaction to think of yourself as the big brother, regardless of what happens on the field.

    2. The Yankees were never shy about the curse of the Bambino, why should we be shy about the curse that continues to haunt you?

    3. It reaffirms an arrogance that only a "true meeeechigan" fan could have.

    signature image

    laconophilia is everywhere... http://www.msu-umbig10.com/

  • SpartanTailgate

    OTPT

    MrWoodson said... (original post)

    I love how all you Sparty fans have fully accepted the fact that you are our little bro. I mean, we don't even have to bring it up anymore. You simply refer to yourselves that way.

    Let's put it this way, if little bro dominates you, why would you want to be the older bro who still brags about his glory days back in high school?

    "If you're worried about Wolverine fans, just move to Pasadena. You'll never have to deal with 'em."

  • SpartanRocky said... (original post)

    So, honestly, in your deepest heart of hearts, you truly believe that Steve Fisher was a more honest, ethical, and morally law-abiding coach than Tom Izzo?

    I don't really think about it at all. The reality is that most coaches probably try to follow the rules but occasionally screw up. Do I think Izzo intentionally violated NCAA rules? No. But I also don't think he's some pinnacle of virtue who deserves special praise for his ethics because he is so much cleaner than everyone else. I think it says something that Izzo has coached as long as he has without major violations. But the same is true of Fisher. Fisher has never been charged with any violations, including in connection with the Ed Martin scandal which was investigated more than just about any NCAA scandal in history.

    Ed Martin was not a member of the Wolverine community. He was a guy who hung around high schools in inner city Detroit and his sole connection to Michigan was that some of the kids he "befriended" ended up going there. He was not a booster or middle man that Michigan used to funnel payments to kids. The kids knew him way before they decided where they were going to go to college. There is no reason to think that Fisher knew the Martin had given or loaned any of the kids money. And, FWIW, Ed Martin "befriended" many kids who went to schools other than Michigan, including some who ended up at MSU. Do a little research. It's not hard info to find.

  • SpartanRocky said... (original post)

    Three reasons.

    1. For flow of conversation purposes, it seems to give you a comical sense of satisfaction to think of yourself as the big brother, regardless of what happens on the field.

    2. The Yankees were never shy about the curse of the Bambino, why should we be shy about the curse that continues to haunt you?

    3. It reaffirms an arrogance that only a "true meeeechigan" fan could have.

    I have absolutely no idea what you are trying to say here, but if the net result is you guys referring to yourselves as little bro I'm fine with it.

  • OTPT said... (original post)

    Let's put it this way, if little bro dominates you, why would you want to be the older bro who still brags about his glory days back in high school?

    Uh, oh. Clearly the brainstorming group has gotten back together for an encore.

  • SpartanTailgate

    Jandy

    MrWoodson said... (original post)

    Uh, oh. Clearly the brainstorming group has gotten back together for an encore.

    I know, I was worried you wouldn't be able to understand it right when I saw it.

    Let me help.

    For a long time you used to beat up the little kids in the neighborhood. When you were younger, you even went so far as to challenge the little, nerdy, unathletic kids around the block to a boxing match, something they'd never heard of.

    Then you beat the crap out of these poor little kids again and again and again.

    Then, you had your chubby kid phase where you were as pathetic as everyone else.

    Then came your foundation phase, where you lifted weights in middle school and had a high school wrestling career to really be quite proud of.

    Then, you kept thinking that you were the best, even in college.

    Then, your younger brother went and got bigger than you, now he beats the crap out of you regularly.

    Yet, somehow, you still think that everybody looks at you as the better fighter. Oh, so sad.

    signature image

    laconophilia is everywhere... http://www.msu-umbig10.com/

  • SpartanRocky said... (original post)

    I know, I was worried you wouldn't be able to understand it right when I saw it.

    Let me help.

    For a long time you used to beat up the little kids in the neighborhood. When you were younger, you even went so far as to challenge the little, nerdy, unathletic kids around the block to a boxing match, something they'd never heard of.

    Then you beat the crap out of these poor little kids again and again and again.

    Then, you had your chubby kid phase where you were as pathetic as everyone else.

    Then came your foundation phase, where you lifted weights in middle school and had a high school wrestling career to really be quite proud of.

    Then, you kept thinking that you were the best, even in college.

    Then, your younger brother went and got bigger than you, now he beats the crap out of you regularly.

    Yet, somehow, you still think that everybody looks at you as the better fighter. Oh, so sad.

    What is sad is how much thought you put into this.

  • SpartanTailgate

    Beardy

    MrWoodson said... (original post)

    I don't really think about it at all. The reality is that most coaches probably try to follow the rules but occasionally screw up. Do I think Izzo intentionally violated NCAA rules? No. But I also don't think he's some pinnacle of virtue who deserves special praise for his ethics because he is so much cleaner than everyone else. I think it says something that Izzo has coached as long as he has without major violations. But the same is true of Fisher. Fisher has never been charged with any violations, including in connection with the Ed Martin scandal which was investigated more than just about any NCAA scandal in history.

    Ed Martin was not a member of the Wolverine community. He was a guy who hung around high schools in inner city Detroit and his sole connection to Michigan was that some of the kids he "befriended" ended up going there. He was not a booster or middle man that Michigan used to funnel payments to kids. The kids knew him way before they decided where they were going to go to college. There is no reason to think that Fisher knew the Martin had given or loaned any of the kids money. And, FWIW, Ed Martin "befriended" many kids who went to schools other than Michigan, including some who ended up at MSU. Do a little research. It's not hard info to find.

    What is this... I don't even.

  • SpartanRocky said... (original post)

    I know, I was worried you wouldn't be able to understand it right when I saw it.

    Let me help.

    For a long time you used to beat up the little kids in the neighborhood. When you were younger, you even went so far as to challenge the little, nerdy, unathletic kids around the block to a boxing match, something they'd never heard of.

    Then you beat the crap out of these poor little kids again and again and again.

    Then, you had your chubby kid phase where you were as pathetic as everyone else.

    Then came your foundation phase, where you lifted weights in middle school and had a high school wrestling career to really be quite proud of.

    Then, you kept thinking that you were the best, even in college.

    Then, your younger brother went and got bigger than you, now he beats the crap out of you regularly.

    Yet, somehow, you still think that everybody looks at you as the better fighter. Oh, so sad.

    Either that or we hired RichRod.

    Think of it like a stage where our controlling girlfriend was a pacifist.

    We are now shaking that off and going back to the weightroom.

    (If you are into the whole made-up analogy thing.)

  • SpartanTailgate

    GTASpartan87

    MrWoodson said... (original post)

    I don't really think about it at all. The reality is that most coaches probably try to follow the rules but occasionally screw up. Do I think Izzo intentionally violated NCAA rules? No. But I also don't think he's some pinnacle of virtue who deserves special praise for his ethics because he is so much cleaner than everyone else. I think it says something that Izzo has coached as long as he has without major violations. But the same is true of Fisher. Fisher has never been charged with any violations, including in connection with the Ed Martin scandal which was investigated more than just about any NCAA scandal in history.

    Ed Martin was not a member of the Wolverine community. He was a guy who hung around high schools in inner city Detroit and his sole connection to Michigan was that some of the kids he "befriended" ended up going there. He was not a booster or middle man that Michigan used to funnel payments to kids. The kids knew him way before they decided where they were going to go to college. There is no reason to think that Fisher knew the Martin had given or loaned any of the kids money. And, FWIW, Ed Martin "befriended" many kids who went to schools other than Michigan, including some who ended up at MSU. Do a little research. It's not hard info to find.

    You are the worldwide poster child for delusional walverine fans.loco

    "No one cares what you know, until they know how much you care." Mark Dantonio

  • MrWoodson said... (original post)

    I didn't bring up Tressel, your people did. And Steve Fisher doesn't need exonerating. He hasn't done anything wrong.

    "And Steve Fisher doesn't need exonerating. He hasn't done anything wrong."

    Do "minor" violations count? Does lying to your AD count?

    "Fisher was not implicated. Period."

    Do "minor" violations count? Those count, right? You know that Martin was present during a home visit by STEVE FISHER, and "contacted" the student-athlete during that home visit, right? You know that's a violation, right? You know that was in the NCAA report, right?

    Love the ignorance/arrogance.

    You're an embarrassment to Michigan fans.

    This post was edited by NigelUno 2 years ago

  • MrWoodson said... (original post)

    I don't really think about it at all. The reality is that most coaches probably try to follow the rules but occasionally screw up. Do I think Izzo intentionally violated NCAA rules? No. But I also don't think he's some pinnacle of virtue who deserves special praise for his ethics because he is so much cleaner than everyone else. I think it says something that Izzo has coached as long as he has without major violations. But the same is true of Fisher. Fisher has never been charged with any violations, including in connection with the Ed Martin scandal which was investigated more than just about any NCAA scandal in history.

    Ed Martin was not a member of the Wolverine community. He was a guy who hung around high schools in inner city Detroit and his sole connection to Michigan was that some of the kids he "befriended" ended up going there. He was not a booster or middle man that Michigan used to funnel payments to kids. The kids knew him way before they decided where they were going to go to college. There is no reason to think that Fisher knew the Martin had given or loaned any of the kids money. And, FWIW, Ed Martin "befriended" many kids who went to schools other than Michigan, including some who ended up at MSU. Do a little research. It's not hard info to find.

    I think Izzo is as clean as they come.

    But, what you said about Fisher and Martin is not wrong either.

  • NigelUno said... (original post)

    "And Steve Fisher doesn't need exonerating. He hasn't done anything wrong."

    Do "minor" violations count? Does lying to your AD count?

    "Fisher was not implicated. Period."

    Do "minor" violations count?

    Love the ignorance/arrogance.

    The NCAA investigation didn't prove Jalen got money from Ed Martin. Does that mean Jalen didn't get money from Ed Martin?

    If Fisher didn't do anything wrong, why did he get fired?

    I can answer. If Jalen said he didn't get money and no one ever had evidence that he did get paid, then that means he didn't.

    Also, Fisher was fired because he SHOULD have known...not because he did. He isn't doing anything illegal at SDSU and he is proving he is just a good coach (not a good coach because he bought players).

  • Peterklima said... (original post)

    I think Izzo is as clean as they come.

    But, what you said about Fisher and Martin is not wrong either.

    huh

    Some of you need a lobotomy , IN A HURRY.

    UM, Green Bay and Chicago teams all have one thing in common: They all suck

  • Clemenza said... (original post)

    huh

    Some of you need a lobotomy , IN A HURRY.

    Compelling counter-argument. The intelligence of MSU fans is in full display!!!!

  • Peterklima said... (original post)

    I can answer. If Jalen said he didn't get money and no one ever had evidence that he did get paid, then that means he didn't.

    Also, Fisher was fired because he SHOULD have known...not because he did. He isn't doing anything illegal at SDSU and he is proving he is just a good coach (not a good coach because he bought players).

    You do know that Jalen has since then admitted getting money, right? lol

    Fisher was fired because "he SHOULD have known". Should have known what? I thought the NCAA didn't find any major violations? What should he have known?

    Was he fired for the minor violations? You know...the ones that he didn't know about?

    Was he fired for lying to his AD? Do you think if he lied to his AD, that it's possible that he lied to the NCAA? That couldn't be possible, right? I mean Jalen told the truth to the NCAA. Oh...wait...

  • I could have sworn ancient history didn't matter to Sparty.

    Whatever the case may be, all alumni should give a fraction of what Jalen (or Woodson, or Edwards) give to charity/kids. I'm damn proud of all 3 of them.

    signature image signature image signature image

    HAIL

  • NigelUno said... (original post)

    You do know that Jalen has since then admitted getting money, right?

    Fisher was fired because "he SHOULD have known". Should have known what? I thought the NCAA didn't find any major violations? What should he have known?

    Was he fired for the minor violations? You know...the ones that he didn't know about?

    Was he fired for lying to his AD? Do you think if he lied to his AD, that it's possible that he lied to the NCAA? That couldn't be possible, right? I mean Jalen told the truth to the NCAA. Oh...wait...

    If Jalen admitted he took money from Martin, then it happened.

    Of course Mateen Cleaves took money from Martin too, so I am not seeing that matters at all to whether Fisher was clean.

    Fisher should have known that Martin gave benefits to players. That Martin gave cash to players was never disputed. Once again, he gave money to players who didn't go to Michigan too.

    So, a bunch of players took money from Ed martin, that does not mean Fisher did anything wrong.

  • Due51 said... (original post)

    I could have sworn ancient history didn't matter to Sparty.

    Whatever the case may be, all alumni should give a fraction of what Jalen (or Woodson, or Edwards) give to charity/kids. I'm damn proud of all 3 of them.

    "Ancient History" isn't the 1990's.

    signature image

    "As far as the downvotes. It's a gnat biting an lion" -- A member of tRCMB Justice League, taking the internet WAY WAY too seriously.

  • Due51 said... (original post)

    I could have sworn ancient history didn't matter to Sparty.

    Ancient history? Michigan fans brought Fisher into this thread. What happened under his watch is STILL impacting your program.

    Nice job deflecting what the discussion is though.

    I'm sure you love YOUR fans that are both ignorant and arrogant regarding Fisher.

    Maybe instead of deflecting, you could set them straight.

  • SpartanTailgate

    DWags

    SpartanRocky said... (original post)

    I know, I was worried you wouldn't be able to understand it right when I saw it.

    Let me help.

    For a long time you used to beat up the little kids in the neighborhood. When you were younger, you even went so far as to challenge the little, nerdy, unathletic kids around the block to a boxing match, something they'd never heard of.

    Then you beat the crap out of these poor little kids again and again and again.

    Then, you had your chubby kid phase where you were as pathetic as everyone else.

    Then came your foundation phase, where you lifted weights in middle school and had a high school wrestling career to really be quite proud of.

    Then, you kept thinking that you were the best, even in college.

    Then, your younger brother went and got bigger than you, now he beats the crap out of you regularly.

    Yet, somehow, you still think that everybody looks at you as the better fighter. Oh, so sad.

    What he's trying to say is, this ain't your daddy's big ten.
    MSU Wisconsin Nebraska have put their foot on that snake and made sure it won't come back to life

    Now, you can pretend it's not so, you can wish for it to not be so, you can lie to yourself and say it will revert back to the way it was, but the fact remains we get to play the games on the field. Every year. all that's left then is to quote old records and past glories and to look in the rearview mirror as you're driving forward.

    Look Michigan will win some championships in the division and league in the next decade. But the league has forever been changed. If you can't see that, it's really kind of funny.

    signature image signature image signature image
  • Peterklima said... (original post)

    If Jalen admitted he took money from Martin, then it happened.

    So, it only happened AFTER he admitted it? YEARS later? lol

    Webber lied to the NCAA. I'm sure you're not going to argue that point.

    Fisher lied to his own AD. Do you think he lied to the NCAA too? He wouldn't do that would he? Or did he not know what was going on...or should he have known what was going on...or did he not commit any minor violations?

    Arrogance and Ignorance are a wonderful thing.

  • So if Izzo < Fisher on a morality standpoint. Tebow is < Tate Forcier (the academic genius) right? Because Michigan is the leaders and the best at recruiting smart and ethical individuals.

  • SpartanTailgate

    DWags

    Peterklima said... (original post)

    I can answer. If Jalen said he didn't get money and no one ever had evidence that he did get paid, then that means he didn't.

    Also, Fisher was fired because he SHOULD have known...not because he did. He isn't doing anything illegal at SDSU and he is proving he is just a good coach (not a good coach because he bought players).

    O.J. and that crazy mom didn't do anything wrong either. I like the way you think. Wish you were my dad when I was growing up.

    signature image signature image signature image