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OT: If a Christian commit suicide, do they make the cut?

  • theFightingtide said...

    That is honestly the most difficult road to define right there man.

    People want to say, well I am saved and so forth, and then go on and do certain things and believe certain things without remission for those sins(Even if it as we say, not a necessity) . I encourage those people(Really everyone in general) to read the bible closely and view their relationship with God, because if you do not feel the need to pray about those things, is one truly saved? That isn't a question that anyone but that person can answer. It is not our place to question their relationship with God, but encourage them to do self evaluations on that relationship often.

    As long as you have accepted that Jesus Christ is your personal lord and savior, then yes, one is truly saved. Man is fallible by nature because of what took place in the Garden of Eden and they are redeemed by the blood of Jesus Christ.

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    MAUDiculous

  • Nobody has answered my other question yet. If the ultimate goal of Christianity is to achieve salvation and be alongside God in heaven and committing suicide doesn't earn you a one way ticket to hell, then why don't Christians kill themselves so they are able to be with God, in a better place?

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    MAUDiculous

  • theFightingtide said...

    As long as you accept the Holy Spirit and admit that Jesus is Gods son then yeah, I believe you are good.

    I adhere to all of the above. Although I do not go to church.

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    big john

  • MAUDiculous said...

    Nobody has answered my other question yet. If the ultimate goal of Christianity is to achieve salvation and be alongside God in heaven and committing suicide doesn't earn you a one way ticket to hell, then why don't Christians kill themselves so they are able to be with God, in a better place?

    If all the christians killed themselves to be with God, then who is left to share the gospel to others that don't have a relationship with Jesus Christ?

    signature image signature image

    "There's going to be a lot of people who didn't stand with us who are going to be remembered for not standing with us." - Al Golden

    gocanes_10

  • MAUDiculous said...

    Nobody has answered my other question yet. If the ultimate goal of Christianity is to achieve salvation and be alongside God in heaven and committing suicide doesn't earn you a one way ticket to hell, then why don't Christians kill themselves so they are able to be with God, in a better place?

    Maybe because the majority of people have something to live for & are not ready to go to the hereafter. Also I alway's feel bad for people that take their own live's. It's just sad to think that someone was going through something inside themselve's that they felt that was the only way out.

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    big john

  • ilovelamp51 said...

    I'm not sure what I believe,always heard both sides. It really doesn't apply to me so I am able to be indifferent. If you are asking my OPINION, yes a person could commit suicide & still make it into heaven, if they are truly saved. Jesus died for all our sins. Past, present & future. He didn't climb onto the cross everytime we sin. He died once for all of them. I've never believed I can loose my salvation just bc I have an unconfessed sin at the moment of death. His blood covers me. Rejecting Christ (blasphemy) forever is the only unforgivable sin.

    This.

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    South Carolina Gamecocks. The 2010 National College Baseball Champs.

    goodnews

  • gocanes_10 said...

    If all the christians killed themselves to be with God, then who is left to share the gospel to others that don't have a relationship with Jesus Christ?

    Sounds to me like that wouldn't be their problem, as they are simply trying to be with their savior. It would be God's problem and being the all powerful, all knowing, omnipotent deity that he is, I'm sure he'd figure it out.

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    MAUDiculous

  • big john said...

    Maybe because the majority of people have something to live for & are not ready to go to the hereafter. Also I alway's feel bad for people that take their own live's. It's just sad to think that someone was going through something inside themselve's that they felt that was the only way out.

    But if heaven is so much better and is where you want to go to be with Jesus, then why would you let something like a job promotion or the pipe dream of buying a Ferrari one day get in the way?

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    MAUDiculous

  • MAUDiculous said...

    Sounds to me like that wouldn't be their problem, as they are simply trying to be with their savior. It would be God's problem and being the all powerful, all knowing, omnipotent deity that he is, I'm sure he'd figure it out.

    I'm just saying in Mark 16:15, Jesus tells us to go out and share the gospel.

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    "There's going to be a lot of people who didn't stand with us who are going to be remembered for not standing with us." - Al Golden

    gocanes_10

  • MAUDiculous said...

    But if heaven is so much better and is where you want to go to be with Jesus, then why would you let something like a job promotion or the pipe dream of buying a Ferrari one day get in the way?

    It's a good question & I see what your getting at. Maybe because individual's are happy to stay here & live out their live's have a good run down here before going to heaven. I know I dont wanna off myself & I have my share of problem's like the next guy. I'm more than content to stay here until God call's me home.

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    big john

  • gocanes_10 said...

    I'm just saying in Mark 16:15, Jesus tells us to go out and share the gospel.

    Not but 3 verses down from the one you are referring to, Jesus says that if you are saved and drink deadly poison, it will not hurt you at all. I think we can all agree that if a Christian drinks a liter of hemlock and chases it with motor oil, he/she is not going to live to tell the tale.

    He also said that if your eyes should cause you to sin, that you should pluck it out, for it is better to enter the kingdom of heaven with one eye then to burn in hell with 2. I haven't seen very many 1 eyed Christians walking around.

    So are Christians to cherry pick certain things that Jesus said and carry them out, or only the ones that they deem acceptable?

    This post was edited by MAUDiculous on 4/25/2012 at 12:19 PM

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    MAUDiculous

  • MAUDiculous said...

    Nobody has answered my other question yet. If the ultimate goal of Christianity is to achieve salvation and be alongside God in heaven and committing suicide doesn't earn you a one way ticket to hell, then why don't Christians kill themselves so they are able to be with God, in a better place?

    It's a good question. I'm not sure the ultimate goal of Christianity is to achieve salvation. God's glory in achieving our salvation is the primary purpose of Christianity, and our salvation naturally flowing from that.

    Let me first say that if I had a loved one who committed suicide I'd probably be concerned about their salvation. However, as Lamp so eloquently said salvation isn't so much about wjat we do or don't do as it is about what Jesus has done. We're saved by our faith in the atoning work of Jesus on the Cross as was attested by God in the empty tomb. So, we don't encourage suicide in the Church b/c God has given us this wonderful gift in Jesus (new life). This new life comes with a purpose. For example, the Great Commission (Matthew 28) commands us to take the gospel to the world. Paul says that in light of what Jesus has done for us giving our lives back to Him is our reasonable service (Romans 12:1) There's still work to be done. Finally, Paul says in Philippians 1:20-24 he preferred to be with Jesus, but he knew that Church was better off with him alive (alive in the sense of the life we have this side of heaven). So, he ventured on in obedience knowing that his reward would come soon and be beyond his ability to understand while here.

    I hope this helps.

    This post was edited by goodnews on 4/25/2012 at 12:20 PM

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    South Carolina Gamecocks. The 2010 National College Baseball Champs.

    goodnews

  • The Bible doesn't clearly define this. The Bible says Jesus makes the final judgement on who's in, and who's out.

    No where in the Bible is it ever recommended to end your life prematurely. NOWHERE. So to say Christians should off themselves to go to heaven would be a direct violation of God's intention.

    Lastly, Satan is in direct opposition to whatever God desires. Since God desires life - Satan desires death. He desires for you to kill yourself. Hence, by committing suicide, you are showing deference to Satan. Not a good plan.

    Dicks Fake Eye20793

  • Dick's Fake Eye said...

    The Bible doesn't clearly define this. The Bible says Jesus makes the final judgement on who's in, and who's out.

    No where in the Bible is it ever recommended to end your life prematurely. NOWHERE. So to say Christians should off themselves to go to heaven would be a direct violation of God's intention.

    Lastly, Satan is in direct opposition to whatever God desires. Since God desires life - Satan desires death. He desires for you to kill yourself. Hence, by committing suicide, you are showing deference to Satan. Not a good plan.

    I understand that the Bible doesn't recommend ending your life prematurely. I never asserted that. How is it a violation of God's intention, if God's intention is for you to be alongside him in heaven?

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    MAUDiculous

  • ilovelamp51 said...

    Exactly. If a person truly has received the holy spirit then they should either be miserable while living in sin or really reflect on whether or not their salvation was genuine. I was saved at 8 & lived several miserable years at the end/after college doing what I wanted to. Still haven't gotten back where I need to be just yet but I have peace again. Never doubted my salvation.

    Exactly, that is what i was trying to say. You are either miserable, or probably not living the right relationship.

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    Lebron James will never be as good as Michael Jordan, thus we should get rid of his nickname, "The King".

    amrollZ71

  • MAUDiculous said...

    Not but 3 verses down from the one you are referring to, Jesus says that if you are saved and drink deadly poison, it will not hurt you at all. I think we can all agree that if a Christian drinks a liter of hemlock and chases it with motor oil, he/she is not going to live to tell the tale.

    He also said that if your eyes should cause you to sin, that you should pluck it out, for it is better to enter the kingdom of heaven with one eye then to burn in hell with 2. I haven't seen very many 1 eyed Christians walking around.

    So are Christians to cherry pick certain things that Jesus said and carry them out, or only the ones that they deem acceptable?

    You are taking those far out of context. Figuratively not literally in this case.

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    Lebron James will never be as good as Michael Jordan, thus we should get rid of his nickname, "The King".

    amrollZ71

  • ilovelamp51 said...

    Exactly. If a person truly has received the holy spirit then they should either be miserable while living in sin or really reflect on whether or not their salvation was genuine. I was saved at 8 & lived several miserable years at the end/after college doing what I wanted to. Still haven't gotten back where I need to be just yet but I have peace again. Never doubted my salvation.

    What exactly is the acceptable sin threshold?

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    MAUDiculous

  • theFightingtide said...

    You are taking those far out of context. Figuratively not literally in this case.

    How so?

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    MAUDiculous

  • MAUDiculous said...

    I understand that the Bible doesn't recommend ending your life prematurely. I never asserted that. How is it a violation of God's intention, if God's intention is for you to be alongside him in heaven?

    I believe that Gods first and foremost intention is for us to accept him, and the second foremost intention is to tell others. Being with him forever is the end product so to say.

    signature image

    Lebron James will never be as good as Michael Jordan, thus we should get rid of his nickname, "The King".

    amrollZ71

  • MAUDiculous said...

    How so?

    Lets say this. If a man went down the same road every day, and every day there was someone who absolutely despised him and the man despised that person as well. They would get into a physical altercation every day, well instead of literally cutting off your hand for hitting that person, it would be better to avoid that path in general. I look at it as removing that temptation.

    signature image

    Lebron James will never be as good as Michael Jordan, thus we should get rid of his nickname, "The King".

    amrollZ71

  • gocanes_10 said...

    I'm just saying in Mark 16:15, Jesus tells us to go out and share the gospel.

    and a lot of christians take it too far

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    bama_choas

  • bama_choas said...

    and a lot of christians take it too far

    I disagree. i think some(Myself including) just do it the wrong way, and in other peoples opinion take it to far.

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    Lebron James will never be as good as Michael Jordan, thus we should get rid of his nickname, "The King".

    amrollZ71

  • theFightingtide said...

    Lets say this. If a man went down the same road every day, and every day there was someone who absolutely despised him and the man despised that person as well. They would get into a physical altercation every day, well instead of literally cutting off your hand for hitting that person, it would be better to avoid that path in general. I look at it as removing that temptation.

    I understand the logic behind what you're saying and, in theory, it sounds like a much better option. However, what you're suggesting is not what the Bible says. It reads very clearly,

    "But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29 If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 30 And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell."

    How exactly does one go about deciphering which verses to take literally and which to take figuratively?

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    MAUDiculous

  • theFightingtide said...

    I disagree. i think some(Myself including) just do it the wrong way, and in other peoples opinion take it to far.

    you come knocking on my door trying to force your beliefs om me then yes you have gone too far

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    bama_choas

  • MAUDiculous said...

    Nobody has answered my other question yet. If the ultimate goal of Christianity is to achieve salvation and be alongside God in heaven and committing suicide doesn't earn you a one way ticket to hell, then why don't Christians kill themselves so they are able to be with God, in a better place?

    Seems like you have an agenda with this question. Do you have some hate towards Christianity or are you just confused?

    God places us all here for specific purposes. For me and my wife, we feel that God gave us the means to be adoptive parents to orphaned children. We want this to be the purpose for our lives. So, we don't kill ourselves because we find joy in helping children and showing them the love that God has shown to us. When we get to Heaven, we will be honored to spend time with God, but, for now, our life goal is to love those children whose parents have abandoned them. Likewise, for any person we come in contact with, we hope they see our hearts and how we have changed due to God's love for us. This life isn't about what we take with us. It is exactly about what we leave behind. I don't care about being a millionaire, owning all the things I want, and being liked by everyone. All I really want is to be perfectly content in what God has for my life. I am not a radical Christian or any other extremist. I am just an average joe who wants to do the right things.

    Christians aren't perfect people nor should they cast judgement on those who have misguided lives. We are all capable of terrible acts that would make CNN on any given day. No one can say they are perfect. The difference is that I believe in God and He has been gracious to me. I make mistakes every day, but I continuously try to get better and be closer to the person that God would have me to be.

    The suicide issue is different based on people's interpretations. I don't agree with suicide, but I know that all sins can be forgiven through Christ's death and resurrection.

    WRobins