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MildReTIDEation said...
[b] I guess I still don't fully realize the magnitude of what Jesus experienced for our sins. But if Jesus is God, then any suffering would be with the knowledge of heaven and knowing everything. I can't help but think that detracts from the significance a little. [b]
48GAMECOCK
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48GAMECOCK said...
Actually that adds significance...God is soooo full if love for his creation (even after we turned our back on him and exchanged the truth for a lie) that He himself would come and subject Himself to be treated less than God. He is a good God and a jealous God...sin had a price and He himself paid it. God is love.
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Gibber71
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Gibber71 said...
Do you believe George Washington was the first president of the United States? Do you believe Abraham Lincoln signed the Emancipation Proclaimation? Were you there? If you believe these things, and were not there, you are relying on at least some level of faith. Just a couple of examples.
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Shabutie said...
Your posts in this thread have been solid but this one is a little bit off to me in one area.
You are correct that he was not well-liked by most Jews but it is not Judaism he was against... it was Rabbinical Judaism and the oral laws and traditions that had been fought and argued over for years and years by Pharisees and Sadducees. Many things have been twisted to where they look like he was against the written laws of the OT but that is just untrue. For example, Jesus pronouncing all food clean was in reference to hand washing. There was a huge debate going on about hands needing to be washed before the meal, with the Pharisees being very legalistic in their approach. Saying that all foods were pronounced clean is just a huge translation and context error. He ceremonial made food clean but in no way did that get rid of Kashrut. At this time, when food was being discussed to Jews, it was not referring to non-kosher foods because ONLY kosher foods were, in fact, food. This is something that every Jewish person Jesus spoke to knew.
Sorry for that tangent. To me, that was a good example of one of many, many things that made Jesus appear to be anti Jewish when he was actually a Jewish Rabbi. His message was not this completely new and different message from the OT. When he said to write the laws on your heart, that was not a new revelation... that was quoting God directly in Deuteronomy. He even said that he who disobeys the LEAST of these commandments will be called least in the kingdom of heaven and that is AFTER he got done saying that he did not come to abolish the law.
Many Jews did not accept Jesus because he was against their man-made traditions and doctrine. Not because he was anti-Jewish.
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AlwaysMore said...
Sorry..I did not mean to imply that Jesus was anti Jewish. Just that most high ranking Jews of that era and in that region did not regard him in a favorable light.
I have never thought that Jesus disliked or was disdainful of Jews. Quite the opposite, since almost all his teaching and work occurred entirely in Jewish society.
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MildReTIDEation said...
My question to you is the same as to goodnews:
If Jesus is God, then any suffering would be with the knowledge of heaven and knowing everything. I can't help but think that detracts from the significance a little.
Also, I would expect God/Jesus to easily be free of sin, since the Bible describes sin as the breaking, or transgression, of God's law. How difficult would it be to not break your own laws?
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MildReTIDEation said...
His message didn't ring true to a fallen world until His death and resurrection.
That is a good line. That sticks out as a moment the "Jesus" story could/should take off like wildfire. Thanks.
I guess I still don't fully realize the magnitude of what Jesus experienced for our sins. But if Jesus is God, then any suffering would be with the knowledge of heaven and knowing everything. I can't help but think that detracts from the significance a little.
If what he experienced was so incredibly terrible, then that leads me to question the existence of Hell being a proper punishment for modern people who might lack faith or were never exposed to Christianity. I don't want to derail the thread though, so lets shelve that topic.
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Questions I have about about Jesus...