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The Official Michigan, MSU Thread (CLOSED)

  • elmn12 said...

    Well it was gonna be tough to have our first two commits be 5 stars (Dymonte is a 5 star on scout, so that's obviously the most accurate lol). However, Ferns is a solid LB and Ward is a project, but he has lots of upside. I definitely think '14 will be a little different in terms of recruiting for Michigan. I think that a lot of the guys they are recruiting are willing to wait until their senior year to decide. Also, I think Michigan might only have 15-18 available scholarships.

    Ferns looks to be a good one. Coach Urbs was in his school this week trying to get him to flip. Mattison stopped by also.

    Ward is a 6'9" behemoth. All indications are he will be a project. There is a highlight video from this year where the first play is him driving a kid to the fence like in The Blindside.

    xxmgobluexx

  • Jandy said...

    Narduzzi was never going to A&M slugger. It was used as a way to get public sentiment for a large assistant coach salary bump. Dantonio likely could have gotten a bigger bump also, but instead chose to use all of that public sentiment for assistant coaching salaries.

    I'm not saying MSU is a leader of the pack, but they have made very significant improvements over the last 2 years.

    And if that salary bump didn't happen?

    xxmgobluexx

  • Due51 said...

    Are you insinuating that Narduzzi and/or Dantonio used the Texas A&M job offer solely as a means to get a raise?

    I am insinuating that Mark Hollis, Mark Dantonio, Pat Narduzzi, and Dan Roushar worked together to help grow the public sentiment that the MSU assistants were underpaid. They used the Texas A&M and Tampa Bay Buccaneer interviews to help people understand how underpaid they were.

    One thing with having a generally higher educated fanbase is that people have a hard time signing off on blank checks for athletic coaches when that money could be used for academic purposes.
    Edit: as opposed to other conferences, where their fanbases might not be as concerned about academics.

    This post was edited by Jandy on 12/5/2012 at 12:32 PM

    signature image

    laconophilia is everywhere... http://www.msu-umbig10.com/

    Jandy

  • xxmgobluexx said...

    And if that salary bump didn't happen?

    He probably would have looked more aggressively for a head coaching position, or considered an HC spot at a smaller school.

    signature image

    laconophilia is everywhere... http://www.msu-umbig10.com/

    Jandy

  • xxmgobluexx said...

    MSU is setting up for an elite class if they can hold onto and close on some of their other targets. There will be interesting recruiting battles this off-season.

    Yea, if Henderson drops, I'll start buying in. That would be a big coup and really set up the whole class. Doubt Webb goes to MSU, but you never know what happens if Dawson goes Green (which, BTW, I'm not expecting).

    Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.

    SpartanRocky

  • SpartanRocky said...

    Yeppers. It's baffling, because the athletic departments should have a ton of $$ from the TV deals. It's slow to trickle down to the staffs though; MSU finally gave everyone raises, but Dantonio's salary is middle of the conference. Iowa paid out the rear for Ferentz; that hasn't exactly gotten them much since '09. Wisky's $2.5M/year for Bielema wasn't enough. IU, IL and Purdue don't pay much. PSU is a unique situation. Nebraska lost assistants last year, though that's a program that should be able to write a blank check. You've addressed tOSU and UM.

    One issue is the B10 schools generally support many more non-revenue sports. Alabama's AD brings in about the same amount as UM's but has 8 fewer sports. They spend much more on football.

    AD Budgets
    OSU: $142.0 MM
    UM: $128.8 MM
    BAMA $124.1 MM
    LSU: $114.0 MM

    # of Varsity Sports*
    OSU: mens 16, womens 17
    UM: mens 12, womens 13**
    BAMA: mens 7, womens 10
    LSU: mens 7, womens 9

    * Counts swimming & diving together and all track & field (indoor, outdoor and cross country) together.
    ** Includes women's lacrosse, which goes varsity in 2013.

    http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/GetOneInstitutionData.aspx

    This post has been edited 8 times, most recently by MrWoodson on 12/5/2012 at 1:13 PM

    MrWoodson

  • xxmgobluexx said...

    And if that salary bump didn't happen?

    Exactly. They didn't do it for their health. And, if that version of events is true, the fact they feel the need to run a special covert PR campaign to get money for their best assistant coaches while SEC schools are making it rain on theirs tells you everything you need to know.

    MrWoodson

  • SpartanRocky said...

    Yea, if Henderson drops, I'll start buying in. That would be a big coup and really set up the whole class. Doubt Webb goes to MSU, but you never know what happens if Dawson goes Green (which, BTW, I'm not expecting).

    Henderson committing could definitely get a bit of a snowball rolling. Other players that I could see committing if Henderson does:

    Kyle Trout, OH, 4* OT
    Brian Allen, IL, 3*/4* C
    TJ Harrell, FL, NR RB/S

    I also think it could help us move up the following lists:

    Dominique Booth, IN, 4* WR
    Jeff Jones, MN, 4* RB
    Kiy Hester, NJ, 4* ATH
    Quenton Nelson, NJ, 3* OT

    signature image

    laconophilia is everywhere... http://www.msu-umbig10.com/

    Jandy

  • MrWoodson said...

    One issue is the B10 schools generally support many more non-revenue sports. Alabama's AD brings in about the same amount as UM's but has 8 fewer sports. They spend much more on football.

    AD Budgets OSU: $142.0 MM UM: $128.8 MM BAMA $124.1 MM LSU: $114.0 MM

    # of Sports* OSU: mens 16, womens 17 UM: mens 12, womens 13** BAMA: mens 7, womens 10 LSU: mens 7, womens 9

    * Counts swimming & diving together and all track & field (indoor, outdoor and cross country) together. ** Includes women's lacrosse, which goes varsity in 2013.

    http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/GetOneInstitutionData.aspx

    Wow, didn't know that.

    Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.

    SpartanRocky

  • MrWoodson said...

    Exactly. They didn't do it for their health. And, if that version of events is true, the fact they feel the need to run a special covert PR campaign to get money for their best assistant coaches while SEC schools are making it rain on theirs tells you everything you need to know.

    It wasn't to get the money, it was to improve public perception of the raise. Relax, you're reading way too much into it.

    And it's my personal speculation/opinion, not a fact.

    signature image

    laconophilia is everywhere... http://www.msu-umbig10.com/

    Jandy

  • Jandy said...

    It wasn't to get the money, it was to improve public perception of the raise. Relax, you're reading way too much into it.

    And it's my personal speculation/opinion, not a fact.

    Isn't that the same thing? Nes pas?

    Signed,

    SteveSchneider

    MrWoodson

  • SpartanRocky said...

    Wow, didn't know that.

    How about this one ... Texas ... you think they have a little extra money to toss around on football? They laugh at the $5 million plus they waste on Mack Brown every year. And anyone who thinks they can't/won't just buy their way out of the B12 when it comes time to leave has no idea what they're talking about.

    AD Revenues: $163.3 MM
    # of Varsity Sports: mens 7, womens 9

    This post was edited by MrWoodson on 12/5/2012 at 1:38 PM

    MrWoodson

  • MrWoodson said...

    Isn't that the same thing? Nes pas?

    Signed,

    SteveSchneider

    If it's an opinion that doesn't conform to my way of thinking then it's just an opinon.

    Signed,

    MrWoodson

    signature image

    steveschneider

  • Jandy said...

    Henderson committing could definitely get a bit of a snowball rolling. Other players that I could see committing if Henderson does:

    Kyle Trout, OH, 4* OT
    Brian Allen, IL, 3*/4* C
    TJ Harrell, FL, NR RB/S

    I also think it could help us move up the following lists:

    Dominique Booth, IN, 4* WR
    Jeff Jones, MN, 4* RB
    Kiy Hester, NJ, 4* ATH
    Quenton Nelson, NJ, 3* OT

    We is comin' for Henderson.

    ninja

    MrWoodson

  • MrWoodson said...

    We is comin' for Henderson.

    ninja

    Aint happening. I'll play nice when posting on your board, but out here in the wild, I don't need to shy away from saying UM doesn't have a shot with Henderson.

    signature image

    laconophilia is everywhere... http://www.msu-umbig10.com/

    Jandy

  • Jandy said...

    Aint happening. I'll play nice when posting on your board, but out here in the wild, I don't need to shy away from saying UM doesn't have a shot with Henderson.

    Do you think that Henderson might show interest in other schools (like if USC were to offer) if he starts picking up offers that might be more highly coveted than an MSU offer? Or is he already a huge fan of everything MSU and that won't be changing anytime soon?

    hownowbrowncow ●

  • elmn12 said...

    Do you think that Henderson might show interest in other schools (like if USC were to offer) if he starts picking up offers that might be more highly coveted than an MSU offer? Or is he already a huge fan of everything MSU and that won't be changing anytime soon?

    So, if I might try to paraphrase your question, without the added layers of politeness (which I appreciate):

    Do you think Henderson favors MSU because it's his only offer, or because he's actually a fan of MSU?

    I think it's a mixture of both. I think that MSU being his biggest offer got our foot in the door, where Narduzzi sold him hard on the green and white. It definitely helps that Narduzzi was roommates with Henderson's dad in high school, but that might not have mattered as much if USC/Texas/Oklahoma had been recruiting him.

    At this point, I think the only offer that would cause him to reconsider at all would be one from OSU.

    Is that a fair response?

    Edit: this is, of course, barring Narduzzi leaving MSU.

    This post was edited by Jandy on 12/5/2012 at 1:51 PM

    signature image

    laconophilia is everywhere... http://www.msu-umbig10.com/

    Jandy

  • Jandy said...

    So, if I might try to paraphrase your question, without the added layers of politeness (which I appreciate):

    Do you think Henderson favors MSU because it's his only offer, or because he's actually a fan of MSU?

    I think it's a mixture of both. I think that MSU being his biggest offer got our foot in the door, where Narduzzi sold him hard on the green and white. It definitely helps that Narduzzi was roommates with Henderson's dad in high school, but that might not have mattered as much if USC/Texas/Oklahoma had been recruiting him.

    At this point, I think the only offer that would cause him to reconsider at all would be one from OSU.

    Is that a fair response?

    Edit: this is, of course, barring Narduzzi leaving MSU.

    A. Narduzzi won't even likely still be at MSU two years from now let alone when Henderson is in a position to actually play.

    B. Henderson is not going to OSU. He wouldn't fit Urbie's system at all and I doubt they even offer him because of it.

    The reality is it's still early for 2014 and if Henderson is as good as many think he is he will get a lot of offers from top programs. He is not going to pick MSU just because they offered first and his dad roomed with an assistant coach who will likely leave before he steps on campus.

    This post was edited by MrWoodson on 12/5/2012 at 2:00 PM

    MrWoodson

  • Jandy said...

    So, if I might try to paraphrase your question, without the added layers of politeness (which I appreciate):

    Do you think Henderson favors MSU because it's his only offer, or because he's actually a fan of MSU?

    I think it's a mixture of both. I think that MSU being his biggest offer got our foot in the door, where Narduzzi sold him hard on the green and white. It definitely helps that Narduzzi was roommates with Henderson's dad in high school, but that might not have mattered as much if USC/Texas/Oklahoma had been recruiting him.

    At this point, I think the only offer that would cause him to reconsider at all would be one from OSU.

    Is that a fair response?

    Edit: this is, of course, barring Narduzzi leaving MSU.

    Yeah, that answers my question. I didn't know if he had other offers because I know that sites are a lot slower to update the '14 recruits recruiting info. I think the Narduzzi connection is important as you said, since lots of parents obviously like coaches that they know and trust.

    hownowbrowncow ●

  • Jandy said...

    It wasn't to get the money, it was to improve public perception of the raise. Relax, you're reading way too much into it.

    And it's my personal speculation/opinion, not a fact.

    Root cause, it was about the money.

    xxmgobluexx

  • MrWoodson said...

    A. Narduzzi won't even likely still be at MSU two years from now let alone when Henderson is in a position to actually play.

    B. He is not going to OSU. He wouldn't fit Urbie's system at all and I doubt they even offer him because of it.

    The reality is it's still early for 2014 and if Henderson is as good as many think he is he will get a lot of offers from top programs. He is not going to pick MSU just because they offered first and his dad roomed with an assistant coach who will likely leave before he steps on campus.

    One upside to MSU though is that he could potentially compete for playing time as a freshman. Unless the MSU QB in the '13 class turns out to be too good to keep off the field.

    hownowbrowncow ●

  • elmn12 said...

    One upside to MSU though is that he could potentially compete for playing time as a freshman. Unless the MSU QB in the '13 class turns out to be too good to keep off the field.

    PT and depth chart are always factors for QBs because only one is on the field at a time. And I don't know much about the guys behind Maxwell, but I think it would be far more helpful to MSU's cause if Maxwell plays well next year and their OL shows they can protect him. And they win. MSU's 2012 season was not a great recruitng pitch for luring top QBs.

    This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by MrWoodson on 12/5/2012 at 2:09 PM

    MrWoodson

  • xxmgobluexx said...

    Root cause, it was about the money.

    Read what I wrote.

    The raises were happening regardless. The public becoming aware of the payscale differences simply changed the perception of the raises.

    signature image

    laconophilia is everywhere... http://www.msu-umbig10.com/

    Jandy

  • elmn12 said...

    One upside to MSU though is that he could potentially compete for playing time as a freshman. Unless the MSU QB in the '13 class turns out to be too good to keep off the field.

    MSU's 2012 option (Tyler O'Connor) is nearly as good as Henderson. MSU's 2013 option (Damion Terry) is thought to be better.

    This post was edited by Jandy on 12/5/2012 at 2:09 PM

    signature image

    laconophilia is everywhere... http://www.msu-umbig10.com/

    Jandy

  • elmn12 said...

    Do you think that Henderson might show interest in other schools (like if USC were to offer) if he starts picking up offers that might be more highly coveted than an MSU offer? Or is he already a huge fan of everything MSU and that won't be changing anytime soon?

    I guess you gotta cross that bridge when you come to it; it's easy to say MSU is your leader when that's your most prestigious offer. If Standford, Michigan and Bama come knocking and he still comes to MSU? That's a big deal.

    Best thing working in MSU's favor is that his dad was Narduzzi's college room-mate. That's quite the personal connection. IIRC, he's a huge tOSU fan, but they don't want pro-style QBs.

    Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.

    SpartanRocky

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