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Peterklima said...
Aren't those the same teams that MSU's defense has shut down this year? MAC level and bad B10 offenses? And they got beat by the only good offense they faced?
So, are you saying Denard and the Michigan offense last year is like the MSU defense this year?
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theyellowdart said...
MSU is likely going to be the best defensive team we've played all year. And if they try to do everything in their power to keep Denard from running, he can easily make them pay too.
If you're defense is coming out with the idea to force him to throw and keeping him from running then they are already vulnerable to Denard's play action. If the safeties jump on his little play action move (and many...many...many do.) you have a streaking TE or WR going right down the seam.
Denard hits that guy a lot... and there are times he misses him (to my great frustration :) ) But my main point is, it's just not as easy as saying "We are going to force him to throw." Because when you do that, you do open yourself up to the pass, no matter what D you may have. Like I said, it's one thing to say it, another to do it. Just like I don't see MSU shutting down our running O, I don't see them making Denard a pass only QB either.
Don't get me wrong here though, just like I said earlier, I think that MSU is going to be the best Defensive team we've played, and I think that we are going to struggle at times throughout the game moving the ball. I just feel you're either under estimating Denard's passing, or overrating your D.
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Saintlex said...
I think or #1 goal had to be to stop the run. We cant let you guys set the tempo. You're rushing offense hasn't been what you all were expecting thus far (what ANYONE i the B1G were expecting) but that doesn't mean that you guys cant just turn it on at any time. You definitely have the talent to do so, and I'm sure UM wouldn't mind you guys righting the ship .. AFTER Saturday's game.
If we can stuff the run on first and 2nd downs, and force you guys into 3rd and longs (or obvious passing situations) it would life a hell of a lot easier for UM.
And I'm not Rocky, but I would assume he'll say something along the lines of contain/spy on Denard and make him beat you with his arm. Something that State was successful with last year.
Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.
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SpartanRocky said...
Don't spy Denard. I hate the spy; there isn't a guy on our team that has better lateral speed than Denard's straight line speed (duh), so unless the DL is forcing Denard to hesitate, all the spy would do is look silly trying to run Denard down from behind. It also removes a defender from most plays (like, umm, passing plays) making it easier for Denard to complete passes down field.
Contain, OTOH, is where you start.
If I see the D-ends make a single inside move (unless it's 3rd and 25), I'll go crazy. Stay in your lanes and keep Denard between the tackles. The more bodies he has to go around, the slower he is. I really think the D-tackles are the key to forcing him to throw quickly. That'll be the key, getting Robinson to get rid of the ball before he's ready. Forget sacks; if we get 1, I'll be estatic, but the better results are poor, forced passes and minimal rushes after the pocket's collapsed. I'm glad we have athletic OLBs, as they're going to be tested.
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Ducksworth said...
For the spy, NW did something weird putting Marks out there on defense. For comparison's sake, it would be like you taking out a LB and putting in Martin on defense and have his job be just watching and containing Denard.
Michigan State does not and will not run the 3-4 defense.
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SpartanRocky said...
It was a relatively desperate move by a team that needed to pull out all the stops to try and contain Denard.
Quite frankly, you'll be facing a much better front 7 than Northwestern, so I don't think the wacky adjustments are needed. I'm fine with Dennard getting 300 yards of O, if the rest of your squad only manages 46 or something like that.
The old "you can't control him, you can only hope to contain him" line works. I fully believe that MSU, as a team, is too good for Denard to beat on his own. If your RBs get 100 yards on their own, though, then it's problematic.
I know he went all around Notre Dame this year, but the 3-4 vs. the 4-3 actually weighs in favor of MSU. More lineman at the point of attack means the running lanes are a bit more clogged, which makes it harder for Denard to get going. I'm not saying we'll shut him down, but holding him to like 4 ypc and under 100 yards? I could see that.
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theyellowdart said...
MSU is likely going to be the best defensive team we've played all year. And if they try to do everything in their power to keep Denard from running, he can easily make them pay too.
If you're defense is coming out with the idea to force him to throw and keeping him from running then they are already vulnerable to Denard's play action. If the safeties jump on his little play action move (and many...many...many do.) you have a streaking TE or WR going right down the seam.
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MiamiSpartan said...
You're assuming it will take 10-11 guys to stop him on the run. I think we have to do it with the front 7. And not even really stop him running, just contain him. Don't try to force him to pass by over playing the run. Just stay disciplined, stay in the gaps, don't lose contain. Let him get 4-5 yards and take a beating on the end of it. Keep him in that range, and Borges will want him passing just to preserve him.
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Ducksworth said...
Oh I completely agree that your front 7 and defense is much better than Northwestern. Sorry, I wasn't saying that that was something you should do. Just an interesting thing to see.
I would feel much better about this game if you didn't stop him so effectively last year. That scares me a lot and makes me think we could see a lot of the same this year: running game getting shut down, Denard panicking and throwing an INT. The only thing that makes me think that may not happen this year is Borges. He's been brilliant so far, and it'll be a wonderful schematic battle between Borges and Narduzzi (?). Should be fun to watch.
We'll be watching the game exactly three days from now Can't wait!
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theyellowdart said...
I wasn't assuming it was going to take 10-11, but I certainly was assuming that it's going to take more than just your front 7.
However, I was responding to the point of MSU's Defense "forcing" Denard to throw. Trying to keep him contained with your front 7 is certainly not what I would describe has forcing him to throw it. :) It's also much much easier to say things like "Stay disciplined, stay in the gaps, don't lose contain." than to actually execute them against a talent like Denard. Because one mistake and he can really make you pay.
Not to mention, if Denard is getting 4-5 yards a pop you're not going to see Borges go away from him.
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Royal said...
Look at it this way: your primary offensive weapon was shut down pretty well last year. What changes have been made so that his growth as a player exceeds the growth of the MSU defense? Our defense has improved since last year and your offense is not as explosive as it was under RichRod, whether UM fans want to admit it or not.
This post was edited by Saintlex on 10/12/2011 at 1:00 PM
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Royal said...
Look at it this way: your primary offensive weapon was shut down pretty well last year. What changes have been made so that his growth as a player exceeds the growth of the MSU defense? Our defense has improved since last year and your offense is not as explosive as it was under RichRod, whether UM fans want to admit it or not.
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Royal said...
Look at it this way: your primary offensive weapon was shut down pretty well last year. What changes have been made so that his growth as a player exceeds the growth of the MSU defense? Our defense has improved since last year and your offense is not as explosive as it was under RichRod, whether UM fans want to admit it or not.
This post was edited by Peterklima on 10/12/2011 at 1:28 PM
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