MNF....Yikes

MNF....Yikes

  • The Lamar Jackson MVP Tour continues, probably deservedly so. As a Browns fan it's getting hard to tune out the media praise machine running in overdrive. The Rams are just a shell of last year's team, they're starting a Browns' cast off at RG, but still. If Wade Fuuking Phillips can't scheme up a way to slow down the Ravens with Aaron Donald and Jalen Ramsey, well, it doesn't bode well for anybody. And they hung 37 on Belichick's defense, so there's that. I guess next week's game with the 49ers will be a chance to see if there's a team that can beat them down. How in blue hell did we ever beat these guys?

    So I went back and watched the game highlights from week 4. How we didn't build on that game is a mystery to me. We actually sacked Jackson and kept him from freelancing big gains. Whitehead had a pick. Ingram fumbled. Ricky Seals-Jones made some nice plays. Chubb had the loooong TD and a short TD run through traffic. Not sure how we did it, but it seemed like we controlled the edges all day. Really it was 40-18 until Snead's garbage time TD. We dominated.

    What I see tonight is more designed runs for Jackson to the outside after Ingram softens up the middle. They're attacking on every level of the field. Power runs up the middle, speed to the outside, three TE's that can catch, easy crossing and seam patterns. All executed with precision and few mistakes.

  • Discussion
  • Gameface64 said... (original post) The Lamar Jackson MVP Tour continues, probably deservedly so. As a Browns fan it's getting hard to tune out the media praise machine runnin...

    SD:

    Punched the Rams in the mouth then jumped on them with all four feet after they knocked them down.

    Jackson from the pocket looks like Baker should be playing ,quiet feet surveys the field moves the DB's with his eyes , then puts the ball right on the money with touch , instead of some too hot to handle dart that gets tipped and popped up for grabs.

    Never thought he could stand and deliver with accuracy touch and timing like that, the Rats and that f uckn Ozzie have created a monster.

    7 for 7 on third down conversions including one for a TD .

    We're gonna need a Bag of Hammers when we play these Mutha's next time .

    >>>>>

    SoulDawg

  • Harbaugh's done a great job there, but man he likes to run up the score. I get wanting to dominate, but what he does borders on the sadistic. Not sure if there is such a thing as football karma, but if there is, fuuking him over should be on top of the kickback list.

    I don't know if I'm delusional, but running the week 4 highlights makes me wonder if we match up with them better than most. They've gotten better for sure, and adding Marcus Peters and getting Jimmy Smith back helped their defense. But we've got Chubb and Hunt, and 3 good WR's. We'll have Njoku back and we'll be at home. We might not win, but I bet we put up a better fight than the Rams did tonight. (If we don't gakk up multiple turnovers).

  • Gameface64 said... (original post) Harbaugh's done a great job there, but man he likes to run up the score. I get wanting to dominate, but what he does borders on the sadisti...

    SD:

    Mumbles and company never take their foot off the gas , so I have no problem at this level with Harbaugh still kicking a dead and beaten corps , they're building a take no prisoners mindset , and tuning up one of the NFL's pampered little darlings on national TV was meant to send a chilling message to the rest of the league .

    Until it doesn't happen AFAIC when it comes to the Browns losing to them or anybody else the rest of the way is not an option.

    They blitzed us for 200 yards rushing the first half of last year, then we shut off their water , and got beat only after the refs reversed a 99 yard game altering 14 point fumble recovery scoop and score turnaround.

    We beat em this year when we were still playing with ourselves operating at about 75% of our capabilities on offense.

    Finally got this semi up over a 7 mile hill and we're hauling that load downhill on everybodies bumper , so from my view all comers have to stop us now , because the roll is on.

    Last week we buried a team we were supposed to beat .

    This week the mission is to stomp the living sh ! t out of that sheep Fckn nation and roll this 18 wheeler over them their fans and the entire stinking sorry azz town .

    Them stinking lizards our standing in our way and they're going down.

    One in a row , week Four.

    >>>>>>>

    SoulDawg

  • Speaking of "Remember When Everybody Hated..." Or maybe it was more "when everybody dismissed Lamar Jackson?"

    Not since Ben Roethlisberger as a rookie have we seen a green qb benefit from a well oiled system. And it isn't like the Ravens are overflowing with marquee offensive skill players. The OL is just blowing holes in everyone. But as a passer, Jackson has improved his accuracy and throws a very catchable ball. Unlike Mayfield, who sometimes gets a bit amped up and throws bb's when he should be tossing a loaf of bread, Jackson remains cool and keeps his eyes peeled for targets. Why zip one in to a mostly covered receiver when he can find someone wide open to make yac? He also has a clean pocket for a sufficient time.

    The Ravens offense just looks like it's operating at a pace 10% faster than everyone else.

    The Ravens OL vs. the Niners DL could be a titanic matchup, and a SB rematch preview.

  • I'd put it at 20% faster. Interesting that Jackson didn't have 200 yards throwing to go with his multiple passing TD's. They just ran it right at the Rams and used the pass judiciously. Other than Snead in the slot, they don't really have much experience at WR. Boykin and Brown are rookies. Not exactly a DC nightmare. What they do have are 3 TE's in Andrews, Boyle and Hurst, and they throw to them all at any time. Ingram caught a TD last night too. With Jackson's ability to run, they really can play 11 on 11 and attack at any spot on the field. Roman did a nice job with Kapernick in SF, and now the same around Jackson. If Lamar falls off like CK, we'll be lucky as f##k.

  • I think we caught lightning in a bottle the first time and Lamar is going to get some payback. We still have four weeks to get ready for them or for Lamar to get hurt, but he's so quick that tacklers can't get a clean shot at him. I see him as another RG3 but I think he can avoid the catastrophic injury because he protects himself so well.

    Without Garrett the defense will be hard pressed to contain Jackson running or throwing. The game will be Dec. 22 - maybe it will be cold and windy and his finesse passes will get blown into the wrong hands.

    Can you imagine if the Browns went for Lamar instead of Baker in the 2018 draft? Teams would have no chance to stop this offense with Lamar being able to hand it to Chubb/Hunt, or pull it back and keep it himself going the other way or throwing to Landry or OBJ. Even with very mediocre skill position support the Ravens have scored 30+ points five games in the row with three games over 40 points.

  • Gameface64 said... (original post) Harbaugh's done a great job there, but man he likes to run up the score. I get wanting to dominate, but what he does borders on the sadisti...

    As best as I can tell, offenses need to challenge them intermediate and deep. I think that's their weakness based upon the last two meetings with the Browns.

    This post was edited by JabbaTheMutt 1 month ago

  • PROSECUTOR said... (original post) I think we caught lightning in a bottle the first time and Lamar is going to get some payback. We still have four weeks to get ready for them or ...

    "Can you imagine if the Browns went for Lamar instead of Baker in the 2018 draft?"

    -- Drafting him was just the start of the process. You then would have had to develop and use him the right way. I'm not convinced the Jackson we see in Baltimore would be the same Jackson we would see in Cleveland. I'm good with Baker. We just need to figure out how best to develop and use him. Talk about lulls. After his good rookie year, Baker hit a lull that he may be starting to finally come out off.

    Shame it's taken this long. Unless something weird happens, Baker will be watching Lamar from his couch when the playoffs begin. But wait'll next year!

  • Adding Marcus Peters to Marlon Humphries at CB have shored up a weak spot in the secondary. Plus they have Jimmie Smith back. Earl Thomas has settled in. Such a good defensive backfield covers up their lukewarm pass rush. It'll be interesting to see how they assign coverage to Landry and OBJ. Anybody know if they play sides or follow the man? Probably sides, IIRC Peters likes one side in particular. His weakness is he likes to jump routes and he's susceptible to hitch and go's. His strength is when he guesses right, it's a pick. Mayfield will need to be careful throwing to his side. Could be a good game to have Njoku back and to attack their LBers with Hunt and the TE's, and get Higgins loose.

    Biggest strategy will need to come from Mr Wilks though. If he can't design some genius *****, the offense will need to be explosive on almost every possession. It's a tall honking order across all three units.

  • If you're like me, and suffering from Lamar Jackson greatest QB ever overload, and Ravens dominating the next decade depression, here's a little nugget of hope:

    Remember when:

    RG3 was the new definition of football and Washington was the new dynasty?

    Colin Kaperernick was the new definition of football and SF was the new dynsasty? Except Joe Flacco's deep passing was even greater?

    Remember when Matt Ryan finally put it all together and the Falcons were unstoppable and the new dynasty?

    Remember when Carson Wentz was rolling and hurt his back, and the Eagles were so good they won a SB with a balls out coach and backup QB, and they were the next NFL dynasty?

    Remember when DeShaun Watson was throwing 4, 5 and 6 touchdowns every week and was the new definition of football?

    Remember when Patrick Mahomes was the greatest QB you could ever imagine with his other worldly passing skills?

    Remember when Baker Mayfield was going to..........oh wait, skip this one.

    Just saying.....not much permanence in the Not For Long NFL these days. Unless you're a Patriot. And I'm pretty sure Bill Belichick will actually die one day, although that MFer just may have a defensive game plan that can defeat even Death.

  • Gameface64 said... (original post) If you're like me, and suffering from Lamar Jackson greatest QB ever overload, and Ravens dominating the next decade depression, here'...

    "Just saying.....not much permanence in the Not For Long NFL these days. Unless you're a Patriot. And I'm pretty sure Bill Belichick will actually die one day, although that MFer just may have a defensive game plan that can defeat even Death."

    -- BB has been very good at adjusting as needed to enable him to keep a long track record of success. Players come and go, other teams make moves and yet BB continues on. But- the one player in NE who hasn't come and gone in the BB era is Tom Brady. The FQB around whom BB has built a cockpit that has led to victory. The center-piece of the BB banquet, so to say.

    Without Brady, BB would still be a very good coach of course. He just wouldn't have had the sustained success that he has had with Brady to build around. So if Death can figure out how to kill Brady as an NFL FQB, then BB will suffer accordingly. There is nothing so far that indicates Lamar will be the next Brady. And certainly BB isn't walking through the AFC North door. So even though Lamar is the Flavor of the Month right now and Harbaugh is currently a Genius HC, the Browns have plenty of opportunity if they make the right moves.

    The right moves. Gotta make them.

  • If you want to beat the Ravens, you have to run it right at them. Control the clock, pound the rock. That's what they do. And that's what it's gonna take to knock them off.

  • First game stats show a fairly even run/pass ratio. We put up over 500 yards of offense and won the turnover game. The Ravens are a much more confident team now, after knocking off NE, Seattle, Houston and the Rams. Their secondary will be more of a challenge. Landry had 165 or something, Marlon Humprhreys held OBJ to 20. Jarvis will need to be wily and bait Marcus Peters to jump routes too soon. Hopefully SF can punch a hole in their confidence and introduce some self doubt in their minds. They are not unbeatable, but they're f"""king formidable and on fire right now.

  • Here's a good rundown from Kyle Shanahan on what makes Lamar so difficult to defense.....

    https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/11/28/kyle-shanahan-sees-lamar-jackson-as-a-running-back-when-he-runs-the-ball/

    “This isn’t just zone-read,” Shanahan said of the Baltimore offense. “This guy runs quarterback power, quarterback counter, all types of running back runs. It’s not just a race to the sideline. . . . You’ve got to be ready for anything. You’ve got to be ready for a wildcat offense, but the wildcat guy is still a quarterback too.”......"It’s not a gimmick play, it’s a very sound way to run an offense and they are doing it at a very high level right now.”

    If I didn't know better, I'd think old Kyle is reminding the officials that Lamar loses his protection as a QB once he leaves the pocket.....and, accordingly, is subject to the same kind of hits that RBs take.....that is, if you're quick enough and physical enough to actually get a hit on him.

    It's a shame the Ravens-49ers game is on opposite us on Sunday.....I'd almost pay to watch that one.

  • Gameface64 said... (original post) If you're like me, and suffering from Lamar Jackson greatest QB ever overload, and Ravens dominating the next decade depression, here'...

    I don't disagree with your basic premise.....the league does move fast....I'm still trying to figure out how we went from 54-51 regular season games last year to a 13-3 Super Bowl. But, I'm not sure I'd throw Watson and Mahomes into the "Remember when" bin just yet.....here's their stats for 2019.....

    Watson.....69.0% completion percentage....20 TDs/7 INTs.....8.0 yds per attempt....QB rating of 103.4 (8th in the league)

    Mahomes....65.6% completion percentage.....19 TDs/2 INTs....8.7 yds per attempt....QB rating of 110.0 (5th in the league)

    Two guys we passed on in 2017 when we didn't have a QB (and had two first round picks)....but, in fairness, we did get DeShone Kizer.

    I'm not ripping on Baker....I still think he's our guy going forward....and I realize hindsight is always 20/20.....but, I think anyone looking at the situation as an impartial observer would consider passing on Mahomes and Watson as a missed opportunity.

    This post was edited by TheDutchman 1 month ago

  • TheDutchman said... (original post) Not sure I'd throw Watson and Mahomes into the "Remember when" bin just yet.....here's their stats for 2019.....Watson........

    SD:

    Can't be left unsaid , as too thats why Sashi Brown should never get another shot in this league .

    That miss with no QB on the roster .

    Is worse than Missing your own Azz with both hands.

    That position is so important , if you miss with the pick and you find yourself picking even higher in the next draft , you do the Jimmy Johnson and grab for that branch again.

    For that ignorant scum sucker to pass on FQB talent not once but in consecutive drafts let alone trade away those spots , while we've been wandering 20 years in the wilderness in search of the grail , is an unpardonable sin , which should ban him his family and his lineage from the City limits of Cleveland until the sun sets in the East , and North Pole reverses and faces south .

    >>>>

    SoulDawg

  • TheDutchman said... (original post) Not sure I'd throw Watson and Mahomes into the "Remember when" bin just yet.....here's their stats for 2019.....Watson........

    Oh, I wasn't trying to drag either Watson or Mahomes, just pointing out that both seemed to be "once in a generation" talents when they first took the league by storm. Once in a generation has shrunk to once every few years. Today, Lamar seems to have eclipsed them both. In some other thread a while ago, I wrote about how it seems much easier these days for college QBs to acclimate to the pro level in a hurry. Rule changes and college concepts getting incorporated into the NFL at warp speed has seemed to allow teams to find QB talent without the long break-in period of years past. Maybe that's just a false impression, but imo QB talent is much more prevalent today. You've got Watson, Mahomes, Wentz, Mayfield, Murray, Darnold, Allen and Jackson all playing at a high level, and Watson, Mahomes and Jackson playing on a level comparable to Brady, Rogers, Wilson, Brees, etc. Top that off with the expectations about Burrow, Lawrence, Fromme, Hurts, and pre-injury Tua. Then add in suprising play from vets like Tannehill, Brisette and Bridgewater and its hard not to conclude that the level of QB play in the NFL is at some all time high. Even Daniel Jones, Kyle Allen and Minshew were playing better than anyone expected. Miami, TB, Cinci, Denver and maybe Pittsburgh have issues. That 27 out of 32 teams are pretty satisfied at the position feels unprecedented to me.

    And the irony that John Elway can't find a QB for the Broncos is just delicious.

    This post was edited by Gameface64 1 month ago

  • SoulDawg74 said... (original post) SD:Can't be left unsaid , as too thats why Sashi Brown should never get another shot in this league .That miss with no QB on the roster .Is ...

    "Can't be left unsaid , as too thats why Sashi Brown should never get another shot in this league .
    That miss with no QB on the roster ."

    -- Yeah. It's amazing that a guy who had no experience in NFL personnel should have been allowed to single-handedly take over the draft and grab guys only he wanted for some bizarro reason.

    Almost unbelievable, in fact.

  • Gameface64 said... (original post) Oh, I wasn't trying to drag either Watson or Mahomes, just pointing out that both seemed to be "once in a generation" talents whe...

    SD

    What’s left unsaid IMO it’s absurd to think What Jackson is doing represents some market trend or a shift in the position .

    He’s unique in that he worked hard to hone his craft as a passer while adding 22 lbs of muscle to toughen up his endurance as a runner , but the catch remains in order to emulate his success the QB must first posses his 4.3 speed

    While you can coach up the rest and build up strength and endurance ,there is no coaching formula to pyy th induce that type God given speed.

    After this offseason teams will emulate the Gap charge scheme instituted by the Browns in the second half of last year and played four quarters of this year and shut off the water of their three TE base set.

    Until we don’t , Cleveland so far is the only one holding their kryptonite.

    All QB’s in general are the beneficiary of Pro teams modifying their offenses to the concepts already practiced by these kids since Higgxchool and the relaxed rules of coverages and QB protection that favors the QB’ ‘s to the point humps produce now , what once only the elite QBs could do .

    The eyes however don’t lie

    The Mason Rudolph’s of the world However will never be mistaken for Pat Mahomes .

    Might as well say LT to Walleye because they both played linebacker are the same animal .

    For us Baker has to get his sorry **** focused to come in start of the season at the level he’s at now and then improve from there .

    Cocking off the offseason Which I alleged and was recently confirmed is no longer an option , and his arrogance in that regard this offseason may yet cost us this season despite the best efforts to scramble like a mutha now and makeup for that impertinent stupidity .

    Keep winning Mutha f ughker and go forth and sin no more :)

    Death to the inbred

    >>>

    SoulDawg

  • Gameface64 said... (original post) Oh, I wasn't trying to drag either Watson or Mahomes, just pointing out that both seemed to be "once in a generation" talents whe...

    Yeah....agree that the QB play does seem to be on an upswing. I don't know if you give much credence to the QB rating numbers.....I tend to keep an eye on them.....they're good for comparative purposes if nothing else.

    Anyhow, it you look at the latest ratings from CBS Sports, there are 12 QBs who have a rating of 100+.....which is probably the cutoff for exceptional QB play nowadays. Most of them are the usual suspects....Rodgers, Wilson, Mahomes, Brees, Cousins, Watson, Prescott, Garoppola, Stafford and Jackson...with Tanneyhill and Carr being the surprises.

    There's another 4 guys.....Ryan, Murray, Brissett and Foles....between 90 and 100 which would seem to be the cutoff for solid QB play. That means there's another 14 starters below 90 which would seem to be an area of concern....that list includes most of the young guys (Baker, Darnold, J. Allen, K. Allen, Goff, Wentz, Trubisky, Jones, Haskins (whose rating is off the charts bad) and Winston....and a few old guy surprises (Brady and Rivers), as well as guys like Dalton and Fitzpatrick.

    Not sure what all that means....altho, I do think there may be more teams concerned about their QB play than we think.

    But, yeah.....watching Elway struggle to find his guy is fun to watch. I think he showed his ineptitude when he went with Flacco this year....Lol. The really sad part tho is that we still couldn't beat the bastard.

  • QB rating is OK, but it's heavily weighted against interceptions.

    If you think more teams are worried, who ya got other than the 5 I named? Not being contentious, just curious.

  • SoulDawg74 said... (original post) All QB’s in general are the beneficiary of Pro teams modifying their offenses to the concepts already practiced by these kids since Higgxchool a...

    Yep, but there also seems to be an influx of real talent from the college game. High school teams play more sophisticated passing schemes than in the past, kids coming up are getting a lot more reps than back in the day.

    This post was edited by Gameface64 1 month ago

  • Gameface64 said... (original post) Yep, but there also seems to be an influx of real talent from the college game. High school teams play more sophisticated passing schemes than i...

    SD:

    Conceptually sophisticated to a point ,

    The coaches use Rote memorization flashing the entire play into the team via sideline placards

    Fundamentally these players in general are dumber than fence posts .

    The base change is the best athletes now play QB instead of being encouraged to play other positions.

    Dual threat QBs are now considered assets instead of bad words used to describe half backs playing the position with scattershot passing games .

    To dominate at the pro level in the manner the truly great Collegians do in College requires a superior athlete who can make pros look like they’re Collegians .

    Right now Jackson is exploiting that phenomenon where he looks like the man playing against boys.

    That’s a rare feat like a Tiger Woods in his prime,.

    Often imitated seldom duplicated .

    The. Rat style investation will stop simply becsuse there aren’t enough numbers and personnel ( QB’s &TE’s )and coaches to dominate the league in that style to complete the revolution .

    SoulDawg

  • Gameface64 said... (original post) QB rating is OK, but it's heavily weighted against interceptions. If you think more teams are worried, who ya got other than the 5 I named? ...

    I would add the Chargers (Old Man Rivers is just that), Tennessee (not totally sold on Tanneyhill and Mariota is gone), Oakland (Gruden's never satisfied), the Rams (Goff has regressed significantly), the Eagles (Wentz is getting booed at home).....and just maybe the Patriots. Brady can still throw it....but, he's looking more and more like a statue in the pocket....Kraft would never let him go but Belichick couldn't care less about what you did for him yesterday....and Brady's contract let's him decide where he plays next year.

  • I'll agree on the Chargers' need, but they're the most snake bitten team in the NFL the last few years. My bet is they try to get healthy and wring another year out of Rivers rather than rebuild. Eagles won't give up on Wentz, same with the Rams and Goff. Both those teams have more problems than just the QB. Carr is playing great, if Chucky ditches him, it'll be more hubris than need. Tennessee will roll with Tannehill until he shows regression, maybe they'll take a dev QB in the mid rounds, but that's all. I think he's their starter next year, they're not built to be QB dependent anyway.

    Brady, not yet. Nobody's touching him until his arm falls off his body.